C5 - clicking with revs [solved]

[Mandrake]

Well at least you've identified the source of the noise, even if we're not sure why its so noisy, and its only taken 76 posts over 5 pages, something of a record compared to my thread.

The good news is that we now know its not anything on the engine itself like problems with hydraulic tappets, spark issues etc that were being suspected, and is most likely something fairly minor, and certainly not something that is going to cause a break down or engine failure. At most its just an annoyance, and if I remember right you said it only occurs when the ambient temperature is consistently below a certain point, and wasn't doing it in summer ?

[Ben82]

Wasn't happening before my thermostat issue for sure. We haven't had temperatures go up too much probably been up to about 9c recently , but I don't recall having a click free drive in a long time. It has certainly became more consistent since I originally posted, and the weather hasn't changed a great deal since then.

[Mandrake]

I've been doing a bit of searching but can't find much information. It's most often referred to as the EVAP valve or EVAP solenoid, and there are a lot of people reporting them to be noisy but most of the responses to those questions seem to be that the clicking is normal...and that its normal for them to cycle on fairly frequently when driving, however I have seen a few posts where the clicking got a lot louder and was fixed by replacing the solenoid, so perhaps they can get noisy with age.

Another factor is they usually seem to be mounted on an isolating rubber block to minimise noise transmission into the cabin, so if the body of the solenoid is hard up against something metal that could make it seem noisier in the cabin. It seems like its mounted in a poor location on the C5 if it is indeed mounted on or near the firewall... I'm pretty sure the Xantia one is actually mounted inside the front left wing to the left of the battery - at least thats where the vacuum hose from the throttle body goes!

If its not too expensive and is easy to get at the next step is probably to just replace it and see what happens, making sure that its correctly mounted on its isolating rubber mounting...

[Ben82]

You make a good point Simon... could it in fact be that the rubber in the bracket etc has gone bad, and is not absorbing the clicking? When in the cabin the clicking does sound like it's coming more from where the engine is, so it seems like it's "travelling".... The bracket and support clip come to about £3, so maybe worth trying to replace those first. (i'm guessing what's listed as the bracket is the bit with the rubber - see bottom of page 4 for the diagram).

[Ben82]

minor update on this.. the bits that I wanted from Citroen came to about £43 in Sweden vs £29.55 in the UK.. since it's not an urgent thing, got my mum to get them from Citroen in the UK (they have needed to order them in). And will see how much it is to cost to post, but can't see it being more than a few quid. If it is then I'll get them next month when I'm over there.
Decided to get the bracket etc to go with it (don't think I need them really, but might as well replace them - from what I can tell holding on to it whilst it is making the noise doesn't give any discernible reduction), also ordered some "blind rivets" for replacing the ones I've (or indeed other people have) broken along the way

[Ben82]

Over a month on I finally have the parts in my hand (and in the right country)

Tomorrow is looking to be a dry day so hopefully will fit it then

[Mandrake]

I'd forgotten all about this clicking noise. Good luck with the work tomorrow and let us know how it goes...

[Ben82]

I'd forgotten all about this clicking noise. Good luck with the work tomorrow and let us know how it goes...

I had almost gotten used to it down to the point of wondering after driving if it was still happening, then would make a point of keeping an ear out for it the next time and realising its still there.
I noticed it straight away today though without thinking about it after having a week of being in the uk with driving my dad's 2000 primera and then today driving the MIL's '12 Colt. Both feel like you're driving a tank compared to the c5.

Also on the agenda for tomorrow is a bsi reset. Had too many occurrences (randomly once or twice every few weeks since the battery was replaced) of the no start that nukes the electronics (and requires a bat neg disconnect and reconnect to get it all back including a crankable engine - cant do a proper bsi reset with dead electronics lol).

Found out today from the MIL having the issue on Monday/Tuesday and leaving it for a certain amount of time will bring the electronics back but will still cause the no start. (somewhere between maybe 15 mins and 5 days - she didn't want to touch it, so the car has been waiting patiently for my return today)

So my thoughts for that are firmly in the arena that because Citroen didnt follow the bsi reset procedure when replacing the battery it has caused it to occasionally throw its toys out of the pram for no apparent reason. I think I can only tell if it fixes it if it doesn't happen for a couple of months, we shall see.

[Ben82]

Right gave both a go today (BSI reset and changing the electrovalve). So started off with the BSI reset, and whilst the battery was disconnected, I started to take a look at the valve..
So there's 3 parts to it (that I ordered)... there's the valve, the rubber mount, and the plastic clip that basically hangs onto a bolt thread off the metal frame dividing it from where the suspension sphere is.

Got the existing rubber mount off of the plastic clip with a bit of brute force and ignorance. And the plastic clip just came off the frame with a bit of a tug.put the new plastic clip on, easy peasy.

My problem with it, is the fuel vapour lines, and the concern is the one under the valve really. My sausage fingers are really two big to get one hand on the pipe and the other hand under the electrovalve to be able to pull hard enough to be able to get the pipe off. each end to the electrovalve is about 2cm long with a bigger bit on each end to prevent the pipe coming loose.

The rest of my time spent was cleaning up the battery connectors a bit and putting some battery grease on and then following through Steve's instructions for the battery reconnect, no real issues, there, we'll see if it cures the odd no-start problem.

I think I have three options for the electrovalve:
1) remove the brake master cylinder and the whole ECU/fusebox unit to get enough room for leverage with hands... ( I'm not sure I want to remove either to be honest )
2) Get some angle nosed hose pliers (probably something like the bottom one here, and give it another go).
3) Take it to the mechanics round the corner tomorrow morning, and let them do it

I think 1 is the least likely to succeed but has no cost to it... 2 is more likely to succeed, but with a bit of a cost, and 3 should succeed with probably the most cost Do you think the hose pliers will be enough to do it?

[Ben82]

Success... Took almost 2 weeks for some long reach pliers to get here (which they did on Monday)... and they were a godsend really... could hold the bottom pipe with the pliers whilst removing the old and putting the new valve on.

After fitting the new one, I thought the best way to test it was to get my lexia out... did that, and ran the actuator test for the electrovalve... Inside the cabin, with the door and bonnet open, I could not hear anything.... I started to think I did something wrong.... then re ran the test, and stuck my head under the bonnet.... sure enough could then hear it ticking away.

At that point, it was rather obvious that it was fixed, but took it out for a test drive nevertheless, and graphed some bits in the lexia.



At no point could I hear the clicking sound I had before when the valve was active with the engine running.... I noted when I stopped to park up it was still active, so bonnet up, took the cover off, and put my finger on it, and could feel it pulsing away... only then could I really distinguish it ticking away.

So thanks all for helping narrowing it down, especially Steve for identifying (and Jim for clarifying) another potential part (which turned out to be it) when all seemed lost

[Mandrake]

Excellent result Ben

From not having any idea what the noise was coming from (and looking like we'd never identify it) to fixing it and proving its fixed must be very satisfying

I guess the moral of the story is that yes its normal for the electrovalve to click rapidly while the engine is running but you shouldn't be able to hear it from inside the cabin!

[Ben82]

From not having any idea what the noise was coming from (and looking like we'd never identify it) to fixing it and proving its fixed must be very satisfying

Extremely! My face must have changed a lot from the concerned look when I thought it was broken, to realising it was fixed.

I guess the moral of the story is that yes its normal for the electrovalve to click rapidly while the engine is running but you shouldn't be able to hear it from inside the cabin!

Yup, even if it is sitting right outside

I would also say if anyone has this issue and is looking to do it themselves then the rubber mount (1539.34 - £1.28) should be an essential purchase, as it means you can have the rubber mount on the new one ready for a quick swap, so you don't need to reach down into the abyss to pick up the vapour line! Not sure how far down it would drop but since it is quite stretched as it is when in place, I can imagine it might be difficult to get back up again.