Don'tShine's Citroen C2 project car thread

[TheSunWhereDontShine]

hello.

so my C2 has this funny problem where the doors won't unlock by remote or button, the tailgate will, and all three will lock just fine, I can however unlock the car by key and open the drinker's side door from the inside.
I have searched for a couple days now (I hate the Ersatz the modern internet has become) and best I figure is either a broken wire or burnt relay, haven't gotten to diag yet, the ECU don't thow any codes.
now, I'm looking for some schematics/diagrams so I at least know where to look, but nada. I am half a though away from just hooking up a tone generator and sound out the wires, then hook up a multimeter and see if the lines aren't broken.

I also keep forgetting to turn on the headlights (every other car I've driven had automatics) so I will add a relay (or multiple) to the light stalk thing controlled by the ignition switch, such that when the engine is on, but not cranking, the headlights are on, and when the engine is off, so too are the headlights (I am a certified sparky with my highest grade breing in automation)

TL;DR
looking for C2 wiring diagrams/schematics so I don't fry the ECU

P.S. am baroque, will not be taking to a shop. spare parts don't come with pinouts either (why?). gn

[ozvtr]

The unlock problem will be a relay in the BSI. The BSI has two circuit cards in it. One has the "brains" the other has the relays. If you do not have the ability to fault find and replace the relay, you can get a replacement BSI and replace the relay card. You can not replace the whole BSI without opening a tin of worms! You don't want to go down that path.

You have not said what year your car is. There are two different versions of the C2. CAN, CAN and CAN VAN. How the electronics work is very different and the circuit diagrams are different.

[TheSunWhereDontShine]

oh shoot! I forgot! it's an '04 1.4L gasoline 54kW type JFKV(? it's on my registration certificate) good to know what to do now, thanks! I can check and replace a relay on my own, but it's good to know there's also the option of just swapping the whole board, it's 1:30 again, I'll check closer tomorow for the exact model

[ozvtr]

04 means it's CAN,VAN electrics. Some bits have CAN (Controller Area Network) BUS communication and some have VAN (Vehicle Area Network) BUS communication.

It's a TU3JP (KFV) engine. That's not important in this case. But remember to quote the car details for any other posts that you might do.

PSF1 is the engine bay fusebox.
Here are your options, piggyback fuse1 or fuse4. Break into the wires from; pin2 of the 16 pin Black connector. Pin 9 of the 16 pin Grey connector or, Pin 12 of the 16 pin Green connector. And NO! Citroen do not use wire colours, they use wire numbers, visible on the circuit diagram.
You can get fuse piggyback leads that you just pull the fuse out, plug in the lead, then plug the fuse into the piggyback lead. The lead has one wire for you to use.

[ozvtr]

Next

Fuse F8 has battery power. Fuse F9 and F10 are the left and right low beam fuses.
So you can use F8 to run the main power contacts of the relay to fuses F9 and F10. F1 or F4 to control the relay. WARNING be mindful of which side of the fuses you run power!!! If you run it to the wrong side, you will by-pass the fuses and you will have NO fuse protection for those circuits!!!!
HOWEVER, I would by-pass F8 (run power from the battery side) so that you don't over load it!

[TheSunWhereDontShine]

Thank you so much, mate! the faulty relay is the top left YH119 012-1Z11-1A, reads no resistance expecting ~90 ohms. I have it ordered, but until early june, I'll just bodge in a generic 30A relay.

I already happen to have some bodge wires in the engine bay fuse box, since a previous owner installed an LPG tank, so I'll double check tomorrow that I can tap one of those (they're easy to get to) and once I got my two relays I'll post some progress updates.

P.S. here's a little schematic I drew up in kicad

[TheSunWhereDontShine]

update: the relay, while faulty, was not the only problem. bypassing the relay I can unlock the doors, but the relay it's self isn't being powered, wasn't fried either so the debugging continues.

here's some pics of the BSI

highlighted is the faulty relay (forgot to picture before removing)

bodge wires soldered

packaged with relay

[ozvtr]

I can get those PCB relays from my local electronics store.
https://www.jaycar.com.au/30-amp-spdt-r ... e/p/SY4072
The generic part number is FRA2C-S2.

Are you saying that the original relay was OK?

[TheSunWhereDontShine]

thing is, that's not the relay I removed, it's a YH119, not in stock locally.
also, life got in the way and I haven't made any progress, lost the only key too, so I'm looking for a cylinder replacement and key set
so far I've only found a full set for $120 plus shipping

oh, and no, the relay was not fine, open circuit on the coil

[ozvtr]

thing is, that's not the relay I removed, it's a YH119, not in stock locally.

FRA2C-S2 will replace a YH119. But it doesn't matter, you've done your mod.

also, life got in the way and I haven't made any progress, lost the only key too, so I'm looking for a cylinder replacement and key set

You need to have the key in the barrel...to remove the barrel. Have you figured out that problem yet?

oh, and no, the relay was not fine, open circuit on the coil

Hmmm I would have bet it was the contacts.

[TheSunWhereDontShine]

I could've sworn I'd posted like two days ago...

FRA2C-S2 will replace a YH119. But it doesn't matter, you've done your mod.

noticed the pins are correct, the photo was just squished beyond recognition, still not sold locally, and why not go OEM, amirite?

You need to have the key in the barrel...to remove the barrel. Have you figured out that problem yet?

I'm a budding locksmith, and it's a wafer lock, I'll deal...
since the BSI, ECU and ignition are all paired, what if I found another C2 Mk1 for spares with keys and just took all those and put them in my car? would I need to do anything special (programing, etc.)?

also the quote I got for making a new key is $250, 1/3 the car's worth, and I can't get it cheaper, the locksmiths are all in cahoots.

[ozvtr]

since the BSI, ECU and ignition are all paired, what if I found another C2 Mk1 for spares with keys and just took all those and put them in my car? would I need to do anything special (programing, etc.)?

Don't forget, the C3 is electronically identical and so is the Peugeot 206 and 307.

There are 2 types of engine ECU's Manual and automatic. The ECU for a manual gearbox will not work with an automatic gearbox. If you put an automatic ECU with a manual transmission, it will work but it will log a fault that the auto transmission is not "talking". So stick to auto for auto and manual for manual.

The BSI and the instrument display "share" the odometer reading. If you "mix-n-match" BSIs and instrument display they will only retain the higher reading. But otherwise they are not matched.

The engine ECU has a unique 4 character PIN code. The cars' BSI has the same PIN code loaded into its memory at the factory, it cannot be changed without "viginizing" the BSI. The PIN in the engine ECU can be changed...but it's a massive hassle!! So for all intents an purposes, the BSI and the engine ECU are paired. There are plenty of people selling engine ECUs, but very few know the ECUs PIN...making them virtually useless!!!!!!

The keys; If your car was built AFTER 2005, you can buy remote central locking fobs from the usual suspects.
If your car was built BEFORE 2005, the remote locking PCB and the transponder chip in the key are paired to the engine ECU. More specifically, the engine ECUs PIN code. BUT, virgin transponder chips can be coded into the engine ECU if you know the engine ECU PIN. So it's the remote central locking fob PCB that's a problem.
HOWEVER, the usual suspects now carry "virgin" Peugeot 307 and 206 remote transmitters. They will work on a Mk1 C2 if you have access to a LEXIA. You need to change the cars' RF prefix code for them to work.

So as a kit, you will need the engine ECU (manual or auto), the BSI and the key fob (with transponder chip and remote PCB).

Remember, the cars built AFTER 2005 have different electronics to the cars built BEFORE 2005!!! Mk1 and Mk2.

The only other thing is the VIN in the BSI. If you have a stock radio the VIN in the radio and the BSIs VIN must match, or the radio will beep. The VIN can be changed in either the radio or the BSI with a LEXIA.

also the quote I got for making a new key is $250, 1/3 the car's worth, and I can't get it cheaper, the locksmiths are all in cahoots.

What does that cover? Making a blade from just the barrel?

[TheSunWhereDontShine]

basically it's possible, and I'd gone with that option, I just can't find a parts car for less than what the cabal is charging.
if I understood correctly, yes, making a key from the barrel and programing the key. I'll settle for drilling the barrels and changing the locks if I misunderstood.

hopefully by tomorrow I'l have working automatic headlights!!
I also couldn't find the mini fuse breakouts, except in 90deg. which doesn't fit on account of the fuses being right next to each other. I hope intercars has them, couldn't find it in their catalog.

this thread really has turned into an X-Y problem, huh?

[TheSunWhereDontShine]

whelp, omw (on my way) to go get my stuff to "finally" install those automatic headlights, she decided to blow the right rear brake slave cylinder, so that's getting postponed indefinately. OEM cylinders cost ~$70, good thing a replacement costs ony $10, I'm puting in the order now, should get it on the morrow.

I wanted a project car and now I got one, wether I like it or not...

[ozvtr]

LOL!
When cars get to 20+ years old they all become "project cars", whether they are daily drivers or "garage queens"! Keeping them on the road is a logistical challenge!
I have rebuilt three C3s and bought a wrecker for parts. I also have a 2004 C2 that's a garage queen. I once told a forum, "Consider it a hobby".