508 1.6 BlueHDi wont crank

[jmaja]

2016 model with automatic gearbox.
VF3**************[VIN obfuscated, can be read by forum staff]

There have been issues with occasionally not starting, not being able to stop or not opening doors since June. Last few weeks have been very bad and now the car has been at my wife work parking lot since Monday. Some of the issues may have been caused by flat battery in fob (changed about a month ago). But now I don't have a clue.

The latest problem has been as follows. Doors open normally (keyless system), power comes on normally from the start/stop button. Trying to start a few first time you may hear a relay click (not solenoid), but nothing happens. After that not even the click sound. Quite soon the car goes to economy mode. No warnings, just very annoying "press break and push start to start".

Previously the car has started normally after a few hours wait or disconnecting the battery, but nothing seems to help now. Although the battery voltage was not that low, I decided to replace the battery in case it was the culprit maybe not giving much of a current. Nothing changed. I was not able to do the BSI reset properly, since I could not open the window due to the car going immediately to economy mode (even with the brand new battery or even while the battery is charged and voltage at the battery is 14 V).

Yesterday I (again) tried to figure out with DiagBox 9.68 what is wrong. I did the global check which found error codes in quite a few controll units, but most seemed to be old ones just never deleted. Engine ECU had three error codes all related to urea system (countdown was on at 1050 km). I also looked at some data from engine ECU and it seemed to have all OK. Battery voltage and current were read ok and I found no reason why it wouldn't start. BSI had a bunch of codes listed below.

U1F0E 88 Transmission and reception fault on the Intersystems CAN/ high speed CAN 1
U1F00 00 Fault event not stored in the faults log
B1808 87 Fault in the unlocking of the immobiliser by the engine management ECU
U1802 86 Vehicle speed data fault
B115B 62 Rear wiper park information fault
B1163 15 Number plate lighting control fault
B1187 13 Main beam headlamps assistant activation button LED fault
B132B 15 Button backlighting fault
B162C 11 Fault: accessories positive relay control and status not coherent
B1716 64 Fault: lack of coherence between the vehicle locking status and the locking status of the front left door lock
B170E 11 Front left door lock switch status fault
B1812 12 Engine starting switch signal fault
B132A 84 Air conditioning circuit low pressure safety fault

I deleted those and car came out of economy mode for a short while. Windows worked etc. U1F00 00 and B162C 11 came back right away and soon car went back to economy mode even though I had a charger connected and battery voltage was around 14 V.

No change to starting. Then I started to look at other control units. I looked at the two related to battery (can't remember their names). One had no error codes and the other one had one, which I can't remember and didn't seem to be important. I deleted that code and DiagBox said something strange about needing to put the power off and back on to do something. It didn't give the clear instructions + 30 s timer as e.g. ECU does. So I just pushed the start button off and on and pressed OK on DiagBox. Now DiagBox said it can't communicate with the controller. I went back to previous menu and no communication with any controller. I restarted DiagBox, reconnected "Lexia", disconnected the battery from car for several minutes etc. But I just couldn't get any communication to the car anymore. After selecting the 508 it quite rapidly shows a picture with a computer connected to the car and then asks manually entering the code.

So what s going on with this car? Why does it immediately go to economy mode and doesn't do anything (except put the power on) from the start button? How can I get back the communication to ECU? How to do BSI reset now or does it help anything?

I found some videos about another PSA car that had a blown fuse cause B162C 11 and no cranking even though the fuse was for cigarette lighter. Also found some videos about needing to replace BPGA. But all those seem to have some error message on the display, which is not the case for my car. I did check all the fuses on top of BPGA, but not on bottom nor on other fuse locations yet.

[jmaja]

The DiagBox issue was finally very simple, the Lexia cable had one loose connection.

I was able to verify that starting is authorised and the car sees properly P gear, brake pedal and start button.

When trying to start the voltage (both reported at ECU and measured from battery drops to 11.3 V for 1-2 s. So the car is clearly doing something and that something is taking a lot of power to drop a new AGM start/stop battery that low. What is it doing? No sound can be heard. Is it the glow plugs or could it be the starter?

Can this problem be just a bad starter? How can that be tested?

[mickthemaverick]

With all the varying issues I would be looking at the earth connections from the battery negative to the body and from the body to the engine. Any poor earth connections can cause really odd problems such as you are having, Good luck

[LedZep]

Looks like there are issues related to BSI because all faults are systems controlled by it or earth connections around it.It is difficult to figure out this kind of damage.You have to go step by step all the connections, relays and grounds.Also check starter and connections.A 12mm and 8mm bolts.Sometimes it is a combination of multiple loose or oxidized connections, especially in the difficult weather conditions of Finland. Good luck too..
A quick guide for starter, is this one. In 6.15 min is the "test".

[jmaja]

Now it's confirmed that starter was the problem. There was 14 A to solenoid when I attempted to start. After i hit the starter a few times with a wrench, the car started normally and solenoid took 26 A peak. Brushes were quite worn out.

It was a terrible job to get the 3 bolts of the starter undone. Two of them were very difficult to get to.

Local car parts store doesn't have any starters for 1.6 BlueHdi, but it does have for the previous 508 1.6 HDi. Is there a difference? What is the original part number for my car? The old starter doesn't have any brand nor original part number printed to it. Can it even be original?

I hope the other problems were caused by flat fob battery.

[jmaja]

The car is running again and hopefully this issue is solved for good. But the Adblue saga continues.

I replaced just the brushes. They can be found with Valeo part number 594060. Very easy to change once you have the starter motor on table. I had to remove intake filter case and fusebox case to get enough access to all bolts and get the starter off. No need to remove part of the exhaust pipe as was done in one video about a Partner. Two of bolts were in spots were I needed to work with just a feel. I used 1/4" wrench set, but I had to use an extension arm for two bolts to get enough torque to open them.