keeping original radio on without ignition.

[CVR]

I have a Citroen C5x7 2009 updated to RD45 radio.
I know the radio is networked to EMF display, via CAN/multiplex.
When turning of engine, the radio over time will shut down due to economy mode being activated from BSI.
Is it possible to install some for of toggleswitch to the radio connector. In order to enable the radio being on without engine running?

Battery and so on is in good condition. The problem occurs when using the radio for example for drive in cinemas.

I know i have to look out for the powerconsumption, in order to be able to start. But that's another story.

I seems to have read something online about switching one of the input cables to permanent 12V.
Anyone has any experience with this?

Brgds. CVR

[GiveMeABreak]

I think that will just flatten the battery very quickly.

The Head units are designed to stay on for a while to retain settings and are switched off by the BSI after instruction from the battery charge status unit, which monitors the health of the battery. You also have to remember that there are other systems on the vehicle that remain on for a while after the ignition is switched off - the EGR self-check / anti sticking routine, the various ECUs writing their data back for example as well as the vehicle alarm monitoring, the engine ECU writing data back etc. Then there is equipment that remains on awaiting your unlocking signal to wake of the other networks like the suspension circuit in anticipation of starting the vehicle.

If you start switching the radio over to permanent you do run a higher risk of flattening the battery and the BSI may not be able to switch it off at all - so just because you switch the power off using the knob, that does not mean the system is actually switched off.....

[CVR]

I get your point mark. But I do not intend to shut off the economy mode completely. Only the radio, and only for a few hours.
Maybe even on a timed /monitored delay.

System works by monitoring charge condition of the battery, but also time.
However the system will initiate economy mode after 30 minutes. regardless of batterycondition.
If you have a separate maintenance charger connected. it will still initiate economy mode.
Part of this mode is controlled by if the engine is running or not.

The radio itself should be able to run without display. "Need to be verified"
The radio will at full volume aso. draw just below 10 amps.

But typically at normal operation, it draws less than 2 amps.

My C5 is a 2.0 HDI. with 77 Ah battery installed.

A bit crude calculations:

Lets say I run the radio for 3 hours, with no charge on the battery.

For good measure we say the radio draws 4 A. So 3Hx4A = 12 Ah missing out of 77 Ah

Meaning I have 65Ah left to start the car.

With respect to the onboard electronics, suspension pump, BSI sleep, keyfob reciever aso. There should still be enough power to start the engine.

Under normal condition a C5X7 with hydraulic suspension can stand for more than a month, and still be able to start.
The system starts up in economy mode. but the car can start, and the all is OK.
So even with the suspension pump potentially drawing a lot of power without engine running. The system can manage.

My point is that for a short amount of time, on a car with good battery and generator.
There should be sufficient power to run the radio the length of a movie, and still be able to start.

Or am I missing something?

Brgds C

[GiveMeABreak]

That's incorrect for this vehicle. I've discussed this elsewhere several times.

The C5 X7 (in common with most newer vehicles) but unlike the earlier MK I & MK II C5s does NOT use the BSI on a timed basis. That was the old system.

These vehicles have a Battery Charge Status Unit and these allow a more finely tuned implementation of the energy management. The device is attached to the battery negative terminal.

The ancillaries battery charge status is calculated from measured physical parameters (voltage, current) and calculated parameters (battery internal temperature).
The battery charge status unit has a role permitting optimisation of the management of the electrical energy.

The battery state of charge unit contains the following functions:

• Autodiagnostics reporting any faults detected on the sensors and/or internal electronics of the battery charge status unit
• Storing of the minimum current consumed on the 12V network when the vehicle is on standby
• Detection of crossing of an ancillaries battery charge threshold every 10 % with triggering of the built-in systems interface BSI1
• Making the measured physical quantities available (Voltage, current and temperature of the ancillaries battery)
• Detection of disconnection of the ancillaries battery

Role of the functions:

• To allow an operator to quickly identify a failure on the battery charge status unit and/or the ancillaries battery
• To detect an abnormal and continuous consumption on the 12 V network when the vehicle is on standby
• To allow the built-in systems interface to memorise the context associated with the discharging of the ancillaries battery
• To give access to the information measured by the sensor in order to assist in checking or diagnosing certain units
• To permit checking of the ancillaries battery charge status before storing the vehicle in park mode

So this unit provides more control over the battery state and the BSI will then implement the energy saving management based on this information. The old system of a maximum 30 minutes was for older vehicles and allowed certain time for accessories operation depending on how long the vehicle engine has been running since the last timed period up to a maximum 30 minutes.

Now having said that, I don't disagree with you that the allowed time for accessory use is very poor with the later system. I have already put together a procedure for switching control back to the BSI to give owners the choice of timed access or the default BCSU system with the usual caution. This has been especially useful for X7 Tourer owners with motorised tailgates, that suffered from non-operation due to the excessive energy management.

[CVR]

OK. Then it would seem I might have a Gremlin in mine.

The car is fitted with this Battery Charge status unit.
Can data from it be seen with Diagbox?
I haven't been able to get any info about the battery from it. Other than voltage.
When trying to initiate a battery test, Diagbox refers to a manual load tester and amp meter to be fitted to the battery. No dialog with the car.
Also I tried attaching a 20 Ah CTEK charger with maintenance function. But still the car initiates economy mode.

A: Do i have some form of early "in between" versions installed?
Or B: might it be corroded/bad connections for the Battery Charge status unit?
In which case I need to rectify it.

You mention in your reply: Quote
a procedure for switching control back to the BSI to give owners the choice of timed access or the default BCSU system with the usual caution. This has been especially useful for X7 Tourer owners with motorised tailgates, that suffered from non-operation due to the excessive energy management.

Can that be used for my application? Any link to it on the forum?

Thanks for info

Brgds

CVR

[GiveMeABreak]

The test you refer to is something like the Midtronics testing equipment that the garages have - which can be used in conjunction with Diagbox. This is separate equipment that is referred to along with other kits for various operations. You won't be able to use that without the equipment.

The BCSU can be configured with the correct battery type for the vehicle (Level 1, 2 & 3 for example).

There is a link below to the procedure, but the resources section (along with official part number requests) is for those members who have made a min £10 Forum donation:

viewtopic.php?t=60776

[wheeler]

Also I tried attaching a 20 Ah CTEK charger with maintenance function. But still the car initiates economy mode.

Out of curiosity where did you connect the negative connection of your CTEK?

[CVR]

Directly on the terminals of the battery.

Hmm, you might be on to something.
Because the Battery charge status module is built into the negative terminal. Could it be as simple as a wrong connectionpoint?

C