C4 B7 ratlling sounds from front end

[Must be Mad]

Hi all seeking the experience and knowledge of you guys and gals on here.

I have 2013 C4 1.6 HDI, its sorry state been poorly maintained.

I bought it knowing from the MOT advisory it needed strut top mounts and lower arms, on driving at speed clear it also needed brakes and wheel bearings.

So to date on both sides I have replaced lower arms. complete hub and wheel bearing assembly and ball joints, shocks and top mounts, ARB drop links, brake discs and pads, new slider rubbers and pins.

Put it back on the ground last right, so clanging or binding when turning the steering wheel, strut top mounts seem to be fixed the, but still have a clunk or more like a metal on metal rattling sounds only happens at low speed and uneven ground, once it starts can also occur stationary just from the vibration of the engine. I am sure its not the top mounts, dampers, lower arms, ball joints as all new and zero movement when i put pry bar or tried to shale the wheel.

This has somewhat thrown met as its the same noise i assumed was the ARB drop links or the like. had quick route about i can replicate the sound if i lightly touch the power steering filler neck it touches the chassis and makes the metallic rattling sound, but question here how or why should that move to make contact?

Only other thought is do the C4 have subframe bushes, if they are worn out would this cause the movement or rattling sound? Very short test drive due to other issues (see below) but ride felt good smooth then when hitting a pot hole was more of deep thump that to me would fit with a subframe hitting the body?

I assume subframe bushes are not a DIY job on a drive as normally need to drop out whole subframe with engine and suspension etc, presume cost to have this done will make the car financially unviable as already sunk a lot into repairs and still have to refurb wheels and replace tyres and cambelt, bodywork etc.


Other major issue that cut test drive short was ABS failure and erratic speedo, was all working so no reason to believe the sensors have failed, will try and swap them out, but i feat its the hubs, the bearings while nice and smooth my gut tells me the magnetic strips are not right.

This car is killing me

[mickthemaverick]

Maybe your own 'My Cars' list box has the best advice

[Must be Mad]

yes foolishly thought I could save this old girl but its becoming money pit shame as its starting to drive nice just way eh

[PaulC5]

If the knocking is from the power steering filler neck then is there a problem with it letting it move about.

Before you start moving abs sensors check their wiring in case it was moved/damaged doing all the work and also do a diagnostic to check them.

[Must be Mad]

Got scanner working says LH front, I have new sensor to try or have look at the back of the bearing, scan only shows LH front faut so somewhere to look at least

Regards the power steering filler neck odd how it just floating will need to get the arch liner off see what is happening, might be that but simir sound and everything else is good only bits still to do is track rod ends but they are not that worn to cause this noise

[admiral51]

Got scanner working says LH front, I have new sensor to try or have look at the back of the bearing, scan only shows LH front faut so somewhere to look at least

Regards the power steering filler neck odd how it just floating will need to get the arch liner off see what is happening, might be that but simir sound and everything else is good only bits still to do is track rod ends but they are not that worn to cause this noise

Yell if you want me to take pictures on my 2010 C4 B7 of bits and bobs, pretty sure it will be similar to yours.
Mine is battered by motorway driving, done 60k+ in the last 5 years front end wise but still love driving it even though it is close to 138k now

Colin

[Must be Mad]

with the bigger 2.0 hdi it must be motorway weapon best car i ever had for that was 2005 Mondeo 2.0 tdci only rated at 130ps but pulled like a train and almost at idle on the motorway

Rain has returned again so halts play on the old girl

[admiral51]

It is a beast in disguise
I will need to dig out the log book but i think it has something like 160 BHP and just looks like a normal daily run around car that seems to leave BMW and similar higher spec cars in it's wake from the lights
It is due it's MOT next week and it will need an Italian Tune Up same as last year. Drove 30 miles in a round trip in 3rd/4th at 70mph ( ish ) and it still turned in 45mpg
I am now only doing 150 miles or so a week compared to 75 miles a day so without the long runs it just needs the foot down treatment to clear some crap out. Nothing wrong with a bit of black smoke when you floor it after dropping it into 3rd at 65 after getting it warmed up

[Must be Mad]

yes the big old diesels are still awesome if you get the right one as i say the old ford unit in the mondeo was outlier transit engine with a new head and turbo only lasted one generation until emissions and sharing engines across manufactures killed it off the 2.2 was even better but destroyed flywheels and gearboxes.
Tried a vauxhall 2.0 diesel the 160ps version in an astra felt utterly gutless and no faster than the 1.6 focus then 1.5 focus replaced them with, then went to the dark side with a Hyundai Kona EV insane in every way too much torque for front wheels and it would seem the reduction box.

[Must be Mad]

Well finally got to the bottom of the metallic rattles. had to take the plastic arch liner off great fun as the bolts and spire clips were rusted solid and never coming apart in this lifetime, then drop out the washer bottle again great access to pipes and connectors short of taking the bumper off.
The culprit the power steering pump. the rubber mounts have compressed over time and allow enough movement for the pump to hit the chassis leg, tried to tighten the 2 top hanger bolts sheared one brilliant great start.
Short of draining the hydraulic system and removing the pump and replacing all the mounts, I can't see a permanent fix.
Once i was satisfied it was still being reattained by bolts and mounts I used a few heavy cable ties to limit sway or movement. seems to have cured it for now at least.

If you are getting the knocking sound like metal on metal go to black plastic filler neck for the power steering, if you can wiggle it until the pump hits and makes the noise the rubber mounts have failed, I hope this helps someone else before they got to pain of replacing every suspension part.

Shows how little so called professional garages know all diagnosed as worn out lower arms, ball joints and antiroll bar drop links, one even stated the whole subframe including engine had to come out to have bushes replaced, that would make the car beyond economical repair!

[admiral51]

Glad you have found the issue and found a "Fix" and explained what to look out for.
And just to tidy up the thread i have checked the log book and my C4 is 150 BHP with a plated weight at 1500kg

[Must be Mad]

Nice one a 150 bhp diesel must pull like a train in a car that weight

Well update with s**t as its become known

ABS faults must have been poorly seated sensor, took it off cleaned it applied antiseize to the little M6 bolt, reset fault codes and bingo all working again, brakes feel much better not as grabby at low speed and no vibration at speed just do what they should.

Massive reduction in whining noise almost gone, not sure is residual noise is the rear bearings or just wear in the gearbox, hard to tell as its so slight gets drowned out at speed.

Code reader pulled fault on EGR, wow what an absolute pain in the ass that was to get out, literally welded in place could not get it to budge at all, after an hour I lost the plot, used la big pry bar under the plastic drive side, very quickly broke it so unbolted what was left of it, no way this was ever going to work again! I was now left with just the aluminum casing, got 2 foot pry bar through that still could not budge, shocked it repeatedly with a mini sledge hammer, only then could get it to slightly swivel, worked back and forth applying penetrating oil after what seemed like hours could get it moving then literally popped out by hand! What concerned me was yes its dirty but seemed to move ok and looked shut, was this a waste of 4 hours of pain? New one in assume it ok no error message subscription expired on my TopScan CarPal so cant even tell the ecu its a new EGR.

Went to attempt to remove the DPF to check how clogged it really was, no chance wire wheeled the clamp bolts the big one mid way up the DPF and the exhaust joint, corroded solid got the MAP gas torch out even red hot no play, just rounded what left of the hex off, ok then I got my extractor sockets (evil things that cut in and destroy hex heads but they work), yes it gripped nope, but no movement, was twisting the whole clamp off and putting way to muck strain on the exhaust. The upper DPF big clamp no chance the rusted blob that should be hex not playing. Will need to grind them off but fell off my seat at the cost of what are glorified exhaust clamps! Was even more shocked to see replacement DPF for less than £200?

I want check the DPF as something is not right no warning lights no no fault codes but no way its been off or cleaned the lack of servicing this car has endured.

After that failure tried to drain the gearbox oil got the 8mm square drive came in 3/8 drive, put a 1/2 to 3/8 reducer on my breaker bar and sheared off the the reducer, still could not crack the drain plug!

Had a poke about the back where the Eolys tank is oh great a big plastic cover with numerous what used to be M6 studs and nuts that are now just blob of rust they will defo shear! Tapped the tank felt empty and hollow, this set alarm bells ringing.
So EGR had a fault code, but did not trigger any warning lights or service messages on the car, Eolys tank is empty so it seems but no warning or error messages on car either.
The cover for the OBDII port was missing when I got the car is it possible someone has played about and disabled or turned off warning for emissions systems?
When the scanner was working it said no EGR related faults ?

What I don't want to do is spend time and money taking the DPF off to clean it if the car won't regen or recognize faults, the DPF will just block again.

Any advice? the budget is getting out of control and still need to repair or replace wheels and tyres and get tracking reset, its becoming a money pit