Another "speared" Xantia strut top...Check YOURS!

mezuk04 · Unread post by **mezuk04** » 16 Jun 2006, 14:43

I'm not learning anything?

Remember people, I am a silly billy (well chris) and need dumbed down posts

Rostami · Unread post by **Rostami** » 16 Jun 2006, 21:48

Hi to all,

I read some time ago that this problem was mostly seen on Xantia MK1 and that MK2 had solved this issue.

Can anybody please confirm?

Thanks!

Mandrake · Unread post by **Mandrake** » 16 Jun 2006, 23:42

Rostami wrote:Hi to all,

I read some time ago that this problem was mostly seen on Xantia MK1 and that MK2 had solved this issue.

Can anybody please confirm?

Thanks!

I havn't heard any evidence that the situation is any different with the MK2's - the strut tops and struts are compatible between Mk1 and Mk2.

(I just recently fitted some struts from a 2001 Mk2 model into my 1997 Mk1, so they are definately compatible)

On the other hand I think the replacement parts strut tops have been somewhat reinforced - although mainly in the rubber block, which looks a bit thicker and more beefy, but I'm only going by visually comparing the new strut tops that mine has fitted vs the originals on another Xantia, so it is somewhat hearsay...

Regards,
Simon

NiSk · Unread post by **NiSk** » 18 Jun 2006, 20:12

If you can pierce the rubber coated metal dome that can be seen front under the bonnet with a sharp small screwdriver anywhere, then it's definitely time to change.

Speaking from experience on a series 1 XM . . . . (got it just in time).

//NiSk

davethewheel · Unread post by **davethewheel** » 19 Jun 2006, 12:10

after reading this thread and checking my car for it's m.o.t i checked my strut tops all looks good on the top (tried poking rubber with a screwdiver and feels solid) but underneath the nearside is showing slight cracking around the rubber, and the offside has the gaiter at halfmast and some very serious looking cracking to the rubber, if i decide to change them do i need to order anything other than the strut tops.
i will take the car for an m.o.t tomorrow to see if it fails on anything else, i know it needs an a.b.s sensor, it's now also sporting a odd coloured drivers door after the top hinge has snapped off

andmcit · Unread post by **andmcit** » 19 Jun 2006, 14:28

mezuk04 wrote:Eh?

I am aware of this failure, but how can you prevent it? and how can you tell if its going to happen sometime in the not so distant future?

Prevention can be done by having good spheres so the shocking through the strut top is damped as much as possible. Otherwise this will knacker up the rubber that you see slowly tearing and decaying.

BUT real area of concern is the metal collar where it meets the underside of the wheelarch. There's effectively a ledge where water [not shielded by the wheelarch liner BTW

] gets to the top of the strut and just sits festering...

I'll take some scary pics...

Andrew

DoubleChevron · Unread post by **DoubleChevron** » 20 Jun 2006, 01:58

Clogzz wrote:Apparently, there would be a sound of metal-to-metal contact when getting close to full steering lock.
Here's a ‘preventative’ job.
I’ll dig up the thread if there’s any interest.

That looks really familiar

In Austrialia though we dont' have the issue with the metal rotting away. Just the rubber degrading due to the heat.

seeya,
Shane L.

andmcit · Unread post by **andmcit** » 20 Jun 2006, 23:15

Well, I did say there'd be more seen soon...

1994 CITROEN XANTIA SX TD BLUE Spares Or Repair ebay item number: 4651992643

"In the ten months we have had to replace the front suspension struts due to the last ones corroding

This bent the bonnet slightly but thats all we have had to replace"

Hohum

Andrew

LeeDJC · Unread post by **LeeDJC** » 24 Jun 2006, 09:00

After reading this thread, I had a look at my strut tops, and the rubber that is aginst the inner wing is cracked. I'll try and get a pic on later. Is this a sign of a likely "spearing"?

**EDIT**

Here we go:

If this does need replacing, which I wouldn't be surprised after looking more closely, where's the best place to get them!!

Cheers

Mandrake · Unread post by **Mandrake** » 24 Jun 2006, 10:21

LeeDJC wrote:After reading this thread, I had a look at my strut tops, and the rubber that is aginst the inner wing is cracked. I'll try and get a pic on later. Is this a sign of a likely "spearing"?

If this does need replacing, which I wouldn't be surprised after looking more closely, where's the best place to get them!!

Cheers

Yikes!

In that last picture the strut top is clearly failing. The bulging of the rubber is caused by the plate just above it bubbling with rust. I would be afraid of driving that car at all in that condition....

It also looks like the rubber block is shearing away around the perimeter of the boot...so it could only be a few months or less away from catastrophic failure...

Regards,
Simon

andmcit · Unread post by **andmcit** » 24 Jun 2006, 10:28

Hi Lee.

It's not reached critical mass YET and the bellows gaiter isn't drooping down but I'd say at the very least they're on it's way.

The rubber coverings both on the crown in the engine bay and the lower face covering in the wheelarch are being pushed away and are now peeling [from what can be seen in the pictures]. It's likely the metal behind the peeling rubber is crumbly and rust is penetrating the rather thin 2mm thick collar that holds it all together.

What also needs to be examined closely is the rubber collar seen up into the strut top from inside the wheelarch - this will split around the circumference as the weakening metal puts additional strain on the rubber.

A thing to remember, is the full weight of the car's heavy front end is supported by these and acted against by the high bar hydraulic pressure - it wont take kindly to additional stresses in the materials under this heavy loading amplified by weaknesses...

I've considered second hand [and have used some already to keep cars going] but don't think it's the long term answer as they'll be going the same way even if the're off a younger car. The sad answer to proper remedy/repair is to buy them new from Citroen or if you're lucky source some from redundant dealer stock that aren't 'full whack' price!

These look like they're going to be near £90 apiece before the dreaded VAT. What I'm dreading is Citroen discontinuing these from their stock shortly.

LeeDJC · Unread post by **LeeDJC** » 24 Jun 2006, 10:35

Thanks for the replies. I thought that was probably the case

I'm glad I saw this thread! I never would've checked the tops otherwise.

These things always happen at the worst possible times! We've got our wedding coming up at the end of July and all money is being poured into that at the moment, as well as the tax being due next week, AND the MOT is due a well!!!!

How difficult are these to change, and is the BOL any good to go by for this? I saw earlier in the thread that somebody managed to do these in around half an hour! Sounds good to me

Lee

andmcit · Unread post by **andmcit** » 24 Jun 2006, 11:21

Hi - the job isn't bad to do - the worst part is getting a replacement!!

The car needs to be totally supported and depressurised with the front end high up to allow the hub to drop down. The only other hassle is after undoing the large 24mm nut the taper on the inner ram needs to be knocked off the strut top WITHOUT damaging the threaded end!

It literally took longer to get the car jacked/supported and depressurised than removing and replacing the strut top! Half an hour will do it.

Andrew

LeeDJC · Unread post by **LeeDJC** » 24 Jun 2006, 11:53

Just did a search on Google, and found a cached post from the andyspares forum. A nice guide on how to replace the strut top.

Just ordered the top fron the local stealers.....£107 inc VAT

Better than a new top and bonnet though!!

andmcit · Unread post by **andmcit** » 24 Jun 2006, 12:43

ACTIVE8 wrote:Is there another way of diagnosing the problem other than the obvious visual check ?

By that I mean is there a specific particular noise which they make when they are wearing/worn, and starting to go, which would bring the problem to the drivers attention, before they collapse ?

Thinking about this, I think there IS a giveaway that it's gonna go!! On one of mine I caught with probably days to go there was a kind of 'stotting' about on lock as I pulled off a rough unmade lane near me onto the tarmac - it wasn't at any great speed but there was steering lock wound on and vertical travel on the strut - as the car moved onto the road and I felt a harshness.

The spheres on the newly acquired estate had needed changing immediately after I got the car which gives me the view this is a major contributory factor in causing the failure BUT the main killer is RUST on the rather thin metalwork! When you get your new strut top check out how thin the whole collar's thickness actually is near where the captive threads are - I'm guessing it's supposed to be 3-4mm thick but I've seen one de-laminate it's thickness to thin mm wafers and start splitting about it's circumference on the crown...

My local MOT guy I was talking to about this the other day says IF there's nothing he can physically get at to feel or see visually, the car CANNOT fail it's examination - they're not allowed to pop gaiters off etc and can only do a visual inspection in this area - sure they can jack the car up and allow pressure out of the system and give the suspension a tug about but not undo the bellows to see the rubberised collar and it's condition. What he CAN see is the surrounding rubber from underneath and the upper metal that is viewed around the crown - some of these 'look' ok but can still hide corrosion under the rubber covering.

Mind, VOSA are aware of this failure point and there have been bulletin updates of their search criteria on particular models/makes where weaknesses are manifest over time.

I'm sure this weakness is seeing many off the road into breakers or scrapped for parts on ebay. I've even bought an otherwise mint N plate VSX 2.0i auto with 11.5 months MOT where the strut had speared through the bonnet after evasive steering saw the Xantia strike the kerb to avert a nasty game of 'chicken' with a boy racer in a Nova barging against their right of way through a housing 'traffic calming' chicane...

Don't suppose anyone has now got a good VERY dark green bonnet and front passenger wing available for sale - I do keep asking...

Andrew