Simon's new Xantia V6 and Leaf blog

Tell us your ongoing tales and experiences with your French car here. Post pictures of your car here as well.

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Mandrake
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Re: Simon's new Xantia V6 and Leaf blog

Post by Mandrake »

RichardW wrote:
23 Jul 2021, 10:29


If I've done this right it should start at about 8:10 and he points to the O-ring
Thanks, makes perfect sense now. Just a badly drawn diagram I think. As long as the outside of the o-ring has a dab of grease on it it looks from his video like it should go together easily without snagging the o-ring.

A bit harder to see what's going on when you're mating them in-situ in the car of course!

I'm just in the process of trying to swap the driveshaft o-rings while the gearbox is still on the workbench... :)
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Re: Simon's new Xantia V6 and Leaf blog

Post by RichardW »

Should just lever out with a screwdriver, smear of oil on the outside face, then just tap them home square with a block of wood to protect them. Check position before removal in case they need to recessed or similar....
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Mandrake
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Re: Simon's new Xantia V6 and Leaf blog

Post by Mandrake »

Unfortunately a block of wood won’t do the trick as there is a tall rubber lip that would get mashed.
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Also one side has a larger diameter hole so I really need to hit the outside with a socket to fit it without damage.

Unfortunately my largest socket isn’t large enough so I might have to go buy a bigger one as I can't find anything else I can improvise with. :?
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xantia_v6
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Re: Simon's new Xantia V6 and Leaf blog

Post by xantia_v6 »

It would be cheaper to buy a holesaw to make a hole or recess in the piece of wood.
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Re: Simon's new Xantia V6 and Leaf blog

Post by RichardW »

What size do you need? I've got 30,32,35,36 and 42? And a set of holesaws that go bigger than that if that's not enough!

Please be the 42 - that socket has only been used once, in about 1985 to remove the fan bolt on a GS - be good for it to have another use!!
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Mandrake
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Re: Simon's new Xantia V6 and Leaf blog

Post by Mandrake »

Looks like it would need to be 46mm to clear the flats on the hex, which is likely to be expensive.

A piece of tube would probably be better.
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Re: Simon's new Xantia V6 and Leaf blog

Post by Mandrake »

Well that was easy when I thought a bit more laterally :)

I just used the hex end of this socket to tap down the edges gently working my way around to keep it from skewing and getting jammed:
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Only took a couple of minutes, and as an added bonus it made sure the seal is exactly flush with the housing - which the old one was.

Cost - zero!
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Mandrake
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Re: Simon's new Xantia V6 and Leaf blog

Post by Mandrake »

And in other news the Xantia has passed its MOT and I've picked it back up so I do still have at least one legal, working car. :D

I had my yearly chat about the rear brake balancing system working as designed causing the rear brake test to be "marginal" but to no avail. I should give up I think but it always irks me to have MOT testers telling me there is something wrong with the brakes when they are working really well and the rear brake force is being limited by design due to the car being unladen. (Last time I put some paving slabs in the boot before the test but didn't have the strength or time to do it this time...)

Ever since I fixed the two broken jubilee clips on the hydraulic pump inlet and bled the rear brakes the rear brakes have been excellent - not even a hint of lifting up at the back under hard braking. That's how I know they're working well. If the car stays level at the rear under hard braking the rear brakes are doing what they're supposed to.
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Mandrake
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Re: Simon's new Xantia V6 and Leaf blog

Post by Mandrake »

Well I didn't get as much achieved today as I would have liked, partly due to two trips to the garage to drop off and pick up the Xantia, a couple of hours of errands etc... also ran into a few snags.

I got both the seals fitted nicely on the gearbox and the motor input shaft is lubed with the recommended ~15g of moly grease so the gearbox itself is all ready to go in. When trying to work out how to support the motor stack with the gearbox and two engine mounts missing I finally came to the conclusion that it can't be done from underneath - at least not with what I have.

An axle stand would need to be very close to the edge of the motor to have any hope of balancing the centre of mass of the remaining stack - even then the centre of mass would overhang the support point causing it to cantilever off the one remaining engine mount, which is not ideal as the mounts probably aren't designed to handle that. With only two points of support the stack would not be stable in the third dimension, so there wouldn't be anything to stop it rocking forwards or backwards. The bottom of the motor is not as flat as you'd think and a spacer block wants to wobble around. It also gets in the way of removing the final few bottom bolts. Finally, the axle stand gets right in the way of the transmission lift/trolley.

So I've reluctantly decided to go with my original plan B - support it from above with the ratchet chain lift with a loop of chain. It turns out there is a good route for the chain to go under the front edge of the onboard charger and under the inverter at the back and then out over the top again without snagging any connectors, hoses etc. By adjusting the loop length it looks like I'll be able to avoid the scuttle. Here is me sizing it up with a length of chain:
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I have some hard rubber sleeving I can put over the chain as well to avoid marking the alloy casting. Because the chain is over the gearbox side (since the side of the onboard charger overhangs the gearbox by quite a lot) it is probably outside the centre of gravity and having the chain go under at both the front and the back effectively gives me three point stability when combined with the one remaining engine mount. So it should be secure and very stable, and with a ratchet chain lift I can adjust the height/tension very easily and precisely to help line up with the gearbox.

So I started building the large "saw horse" tonight - it has a 1 metre wide stance on each side to ensure the centre of gravity of what it is lifting can't possibly go outside the footing, and will be as high as I can make it while still clearing the bonnet with the bonnet stay fitted. (I don't really want to remove the bonnet then have the hassle of trying to align the panel gaps...
stand.jpeg
I have a forced day of "rest" tomorrow (if you call taking a 5 year old who tends to whinge when he's too hot to the beach "rest" :lol: ) so I'm going to try hard to get most of this job done on Sunday and the first order of business will be to finish the saw horse and test out the chain attachment.

A lot of the engine mount and gearbox mounting bolts (mostly the top ones) are already removed so I have relatively few bolts to remove now to get it out - I also removed the 12v battery and battery tray which gives a huge amount of extra visibility and access on the gearbox side.
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white exec
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Re: Simon's new Xantia V6 and Leaf blog

Post by white exec »

Re: the chipped diff bolt head, is it possible that some end-float has crept in with age, which has allowed a close-tolerance gap between bolt-head and gear to disappear? Just an alternative guess. Or a wrong-sized washer under the offending bolt?
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Re: Simon's new Xantia V6 and Leaf blog

Post by mickthemaverick »

"(I don't really want to remove the bonnet then have the hassle of trying to align the panel gaps..."

Sorry Simon, that made me chuckle!! Compared to the hassle you already have with the job that task is virtually nothing!! Marking round the hinge brackets before you undo them and then ensuring they are back in position before you retighten them will take care of that. I've done it on more cars than I could remember and the extra light and access, especially to the back from the sides, is well worth the effort. With your support frame it will be even more useful. Just have a decent tarpaulin to hand to throw over the whole thingc should the weather turn nasty!! :)
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Re: Simon's new Xantia V6 and Leaf blog

Post by NewcastleFalcon »

Nearly there Simon, but this is the most dangerous part so I would recommend definite "belt and braces" when it comes to supporting the stack. Definitely don't just rely on your saw-horse and chain lift. Somehow from underneath the motor stack needs to be supported so that if it moves when the last mounting bolt is removed, it doesnt set up a swing of momentum which collapses your saw horse. Sideways motion and the saw horse could simply fold up.

The stack is some way off the ground in the picture. Don't let the desire to prioritise the easy removal of the gearbox using the equipment you have acquired, cloud the major safety issue of supporting the stack. A 25kg gearbox could be handled off by yourself and an assistant in the worst case, with the new jack on stack-supporting back up duties.

Satisfy yourself 100% that the stack cannot move in a catastrophic fashion by supporting it from the ground, as well as your saw horse arrangement from the top. The two road wheels. plywood and some wooden wedges underneath maybe a Heath Robinson method to ensure that if there was some movement as the mountings are removed it would be the minimum. (Better solutions may be available :-D ).

REgards Neil
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Mandrake
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Re: Simon's new Xantia V6 and Leaf blog

Post by Mandrake »

Don’t worry, I will have a large railway sleeper block underneath the motor any time I’m under there as an added precaution - it won’t be supporting the stack but will be very close to it so it would arrest any fall. I’m slow but careful.

Started a bit late today but I now have the support for the chain winch ready. That should do the job. :lol:
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I’m 107Kg so about the same weight as the motor stack and I can hang from the middle and swing back and forth with barely any movement thanks to plenty of bracing.

After a bit of discussion on another forum I’ve decided I should probably use ratchet straps to cradle the motor assembly instead of the chain. I have four 800Kg ratchet straps so I should be able to do that easily enough. It will spread the load a bit better and avoid marking the onboard charger etc.
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moizeau
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Re: Simon's new Xantia V6 and Leaf blog

Post by moizeau »

Just one thing about ratchet straps, they're great for winching up but uncontrollable when lowering.
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Re: Simon's new Xantia V6 and Leaf blog

Post by Mandrake »

Don’t worry. I have that covered. I’m not using the ratchet strap ratchet to do the raising and lowering. I have the chain wrench to do that which it does very easily and precisely. :)
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