A 2.1 VSX (as a replacement) Xantia - initial problems.

This is the Forum for all your Citroen Technical Questions, Problems or Advice.

Moderator: RichardW

User avatar
xantia_v6
Forum Admin Team
Posts: 7965
Joined: 09 Nov 2005, 23:03
x 520

Re: A 2.1 VSX (as a replacement) Xantia - initial problems.

Post by xantia_v6 »

On an S1, you can prise the top off the switches and change the bulb without dismantling anything else. But the bulb is probably OK, and the problem is probably discolouration of the plastic filter above the bulb.
User avatar
Old-Guy
Posts: 1798
Joined: 11 Sep 2008, 12:08
x 16

Re: A 2.1 VSX (as a replacement) Xantia - initial problems.

Post by Old-Guy »

Thanks Simon, saved me the job of finding and decyphering the corresponding wiring diagram to see where the heater blower gets its juice from on this configuration.

Had to do the blower mod on the green lady (RIP) not that long ago. With my notes to hand, should be easy-peasy second time round. As it happens, the VSX has had a new ignition switch (I wonder why? :wink:) and a matching set of new door lock barrels :shock: within the last 6 years, so best to protect the new switch contacts while they are still reasonably good.
citroenxm
Posts: 8027
Joined: 31 Dec 2004, 00:10
x 50

Re: A 2.1 VSX (as a replacement) Xantia - initial problems.

Post by citroenxm »

No its not the case on s1 cars james.. and im yet to see evidance of this on cars OLDER then X plate..

My V reg exclusive doesnt do this air con thing.. .not does a T reg sx i have nor had any other T reg cars.. ive only seen the air con auto activate on X and Y plate cars.. other people have seen it on earlyer s2 cars.. and before you ask all the cars had working air con...
User avatar
Old-Guy
Posts: 1798
Joined: 11 Sep 2008, 12:08
x 16

Re: A 2.1 VSX (as a replacement) Xantia - initial problems.

Post by Old-Guy »

RichardW wrote: Built on 03/10/97 - so it's a 97 run out - given the reg ending KV it will be one of the ones Citroen registered to get rid of them - I had R140 OKV, also officially Athena but badged VSX.
Thanks for decyphering the RP No Richard, but the Reg No is R833 VDP, - where did you get the KV from?

[Edit] I've just found the original handwritten PDI sheet! "2.1 TD Athena 2 Estate" and Invoice for £20,000 with 5 year, 60,000 mile, extended warranty.

When did the S2 come out?
citroenxm
Posts: 8027
Joined: 31 Dec 2004, 00:10
x 50

Re: A 2.1 VSX (as a replacement) Xantia - initial problems.

Post by citroenxm »

1998 R reg S2 came along. The last of the Xantia S1's were up rampd as a run out.. but more noticeable on Hatch cars.

However, for info, off the top of my head, LX trim got upgraded to Veolour, and front fogs fitted air con, as the most noticeable upgrade, then SX got rear spoiler, suede seats, alloys on top of useual SX trim, and VSX (athena) got Leather as standard on top of VSX trim... Athena also must of gained the wood on the dash too from the V6 Exclusives...

I cannot say though if VSX Hatch's got the spoiler like the SX, Ive never actually seen one, just the SX model.
RichardW
Forum Treasurer
Posts: 9708
Joined: 07 Aug 2002, 17:12
x 509

Re: A 2.1 VSX (as a replacement) Xantia - initial problems.

Post by RichardW »

Ah, thought I had seen it on the ad, but perhaps that was the pic of the XM on another thread.... :lol:
User avatar
Old-Guy
Posts: 1798
Joined: 11 Sep 2008, 12:08
x 16

Re: A 2.1 VSX (as a replacement) Xantia - initial problems.

Post by Old-Guy »

The car was said to have been cared for (mostly) by a Xantia specialist for the last 10 years. I've now done a service (oil and filter change, check brakes, clean LHM filters and change the LHM, bleed brakes, clean and lubricate height control mechanisms) and I'm not impressed:
  • The cabin filter hadn't been changed for 10 years and was totally clogged.

    The LHM in the reservoir looked as though it had been contaminated with Dexron or similar - just a peculiar effect of (most of) the LHM being very, very old with periodic top-ups; I doubt it's been changed in those 10 years. It looks red with light shone through it but yellow absorbed on white kitchen roll. I've got a sample with which to do a simple chromatograph.

    The LHM filters were very dirty. They looked to me, and I hope, as though they have not been cleaned in a very long time.

    Oddly, the HP pump was replaced a year ago.

    The front height controller was replaced fairly recently but very sticky from lack of lubrication.

    The 4 corner spheres (only) were replaced with genuine Citroen ones in some 8 years and 30,000 miles ago. No record of when the accumulator and a/s spheres were changed.

    One front calliper piston hadn't been correctly aligned when the pads were last changed (not much friction material left now) so that the piston was bearing on the pad's alignment 'pip'.

    Both front discs were loose with chewed retaining screws- small point but sloppy.

    On the bright side, the rear callipers have been 'done', with new discs and pads.

    The newish auxiliary belt is running one groove off the back of the HP pump and the crankshaft but not the the other pulleys - as far as I can see (with the engine running) the front faces of all the pulleys are in the same plane.

    The newish auxiliary belt is loose and squeals at low rpm (especially when under load from the HP pump), I suspect (hope) it just wasn't tensioned properly.
The brakes still aren't up to normal Xantia standards - I'll probably run it for a few weeks and then change the pads if the car is a good 'un.
For a new MoT, I've also replaced a radius arm front bush, and a perfectly good drop link with split boots - hopefully the MoT won't turn up anything else. Then I'll spend the time to sort the blower speed controller and some other electrical gremlins.
taffy
Posts: 1005
Joined: 08 Oct 2012, 00:35

Re: A 2.1 VSX (as a replacement) Xantia - initial problems.

Post by taffy »

Don worry ul get there :)
User avatar
Old-Guy
Posts: 1798
Joined: 11 Sep 2008, 12:08
x 16

Re: A 2.1 VSX (as a replacement) Xantia - initial problems.

Post by Old-Guy »

taffy wrote:Don worry ul get there :)
I hope I will have got there (as far as an MoT pass is concerned) by tomorrow evening. I'm also hoping that the electrical gremlin that has twice flattened the battery, by random, repeated triggering of the alarm, was down to an almost non-existent earth from the battery to the earth plate on the inner N/S/F wing.

Both battery terminals have been recently replaced. The screws holding main earth cable (to the starter) weren't tight and the ring terminal cable to the earth plate was just rattling on the thread of one! Even if it had been tight, only about 3 strands were intact. Fitting a bigger terminal and a new cable to the earth plate have sorted that one.

I've also also repaired the A/C blower speed control by replacing the transistors - straight forward enough with Jim's guide. With a new pollen filter and the blower working properly, the A/C is up to scratch.

As far as I'm aware (that's tempting fate), all that's outstanding is an oil leak somewhere at the back of the cylinder head.
User avatar
Old-Guy
Posts: 1798
Joined: 11 Sep 2008, 12:08
x 16

Re: A 2.1 VSX (as a replacement) Xantia - initial problems.

Post by Old-Guy »

xantia_v6 wrote:On an S1, you can prise the top off the switches and change the bulb without dismantling anything else. But the bulb is probably OK, and the problem is probably discolouration of the plastic filter above the bulb.
I don't want to mark either the 'wood trim or the switch tops, so can someone give me some advice on how to safely prise off the switch tops, please?

[EDIT] See next post for the complete answer.
Last edited by Old-Guy on 15 Jul 2013, 09:37, edited 1 time in total.
User avatar
Old-Guy
Posts: 1798
Joined: 11 Sep 2008, 12:08
x 16

Re: A 2.1 VSX (as a replacement) Xantia - initial problems.

Post by Old-Guy »

Let me answer my own question (above). Disconnect the battery FIRST! Gently lever up the bottom edge of the button with something flat and fairly thin and with rounded edges (to avoid marking the fascia). The screwdriver blade on my (genuine) Swiss Army knife is perfect! The button top should just pop off. You will see a white insert (the botton actuator) with an opaque 'screen'. The screen is loose and can be picked out with the point of a knife or a fingernail. The bulb-holder (green) is now exposed; it looks somewhat like a praying mantis, but may have largely disintegrated with heat and age. Slide a small electrical screwdriver under the bottom of the bulb-holder to gently lever its rear end up slightly. It should partly disengage so that you can grasp the cylindrical part with your fingers to pull it out; if it has disintegrated you'll need a small pair of snipe-nosed pliers to pull it out by its 'arms'. On the second one, I removed the blown bulb by cutting off its wire tails (leaving them inplace) then soldered on a LED with 750R resistor (1K1 would do) Araldited to the remains of the body. If you need to remove the whole switch (to remove bits of green plastic!) gently levering on alternate sides of the the white actuator should pop the whole switch out with plug attached; slide a small screwdriver through the wires at the back of the plug to stop it leaping back inside the fascia when you pull the switch off it! #-o

I've now sorted most of the VSX's remaining problems. Just caught the auxiliary belt before it failed: very badly worn, one 'V' missing (just frayed shreds), and several bad cuts. It had been wrongly fitted (running one groove off the back on the crankshaft pulley, compressor and alternator but not the hydraulic pump) and not tensioned :shock: (the eccentric idler was in the slack position but the locking bolt was really tight). I was worried that, as all the auxiliaries have been replaced in recent years, one of them was the wrong one and thus misaligned so the belt had been fitted that way as a bodge to keep the alignment sort-of correct - no, just a total balls-up of fitting and tensioning the belt!

Now the belt isn't slipping, the car is transformed by having full output from the HP pump and the alternator. Changing the front (corner) spheres has improved the ride. Simply replacing the oversize section of hose (from the priming bulb onwards) seems to have fixed the air ingress problem, but at the first opportunity, I'm still going to check the fuel tank pick-up filter and change the filter cartridge. As a result, most of the 110 ponies now seem to be present when summoned: putting my foot down going up hill, from about 2,400 the torque starts to come in then a great surge from 2,800 on (I don't want another blown engine so I change up before 3,500). It goes like a scalded cat compared with the 1.9, but I've not yet done a fuel consumption check – there's no point until I'm happy I've sorted the fuel system.

The A/C needs re-gassing yet again, but I don't want to spend more time and money on this car than is necessary to make it reasonably reliable for the next few months.

I haven't done the diode mod yet, but the Hydractive 2 suspension seems to work as it should; combined with fatter tyres the dry grip limits are way beyond what I want to explore on public roads (even by mistake!). I've got as far as making up a 'Diode Unit' ready to fit. Is there any point in doing a proper write-up with photos, or is mine about the only surviving Hydractive 2 Xantia that hasn't yet been modified?