Xantia HDI 110 Clutch slave kaputt..

i3 · Post by i3 » 18 Apr 2010, 22:28

honestly, i dont think i would be able to successfully do something like that... wont the pipe leak then if i cut it and fit that in?

i3 · Post by i3 » 21 Apr 2010, 17:56

okay... i took a video recording last time i tried to bleed it....

i made an account to upload it to on youtube as i didnt know how else to post the vid up.....

Post by **CitroJim** » 21 Apr 2010, 19:24

i3,

I've just engineered a bleed nipple in the right-angle feed to the slave cylinder like this:

Basically it's an M6 bleed nipple in an M8 to M6 brass reducer. Tap an M8 thread into the back of the elbow and assemble.

Any small engineering shop should be able to make this up.

You can cut the elbow off the end of the pipe and after trimming and heating the pipe end, rejoin it back onto the barbs of the elbow.

Pictures:

This was just a very rough and quick demonstration of an idea. Given time, a neater job could be made.

Hope that helps with another idea...

i3 · Post by i3 » 21 Apr 2010, 20:01

ohh... thats great Jim,,i will actually try that.... did you have a look at the video i posted,,, could you have a look at it please,,, im trying to see if the fork, was it?, has been fitted correctly in the bellhousing... you can just about see it..it does move a round a little,, back forward, up down.....
also i think i may have another problem... i think i knackered this new slave cylinder... the plastic which held the rod down in the cylinder broke... now it wobbles around....i cn still push it in,,and it comes out...is it knackered? thanks

Post by **CitroJim** » 21 Apr 2010, 21:39

I can't help thinking the fork looks an awfully long way down... And a bit loose.

I cannot now do it until Friday evening but I'll slip the slave out of my Activa project and measure the depth from the edge of the hole to the fork cup.

No, I don't think you've spoilt your new cylinder. The bit I think you mean is the original transit seal. Even if the pushrod falls out totally all is not lost, provided the piston does not come out as well.

I've had the pushrod right out of my spare here to understand how it all works with no ill effect.

Sorry I'm unable to do tomorrow but if you can wait until Friday, I'll do...

i3 · Post by i3 » 21 Apr 2010, 22:35

hey Jim, no problem at all...fridays fine..no need to say sorry

just wondering,,how will i know if the pistons popped out of the slave?

HDI Dave · Post by **HDI Dave** » 22 Apr 2010, 11:37

The pushrod sits inside the piston..so if just the rod has come out, the piston should still be in the slave.

Btw, nice nipple Jim

That looks like a more controllable / user friendly little bleeder

i3 · Post by i3 » 22 Apr 2010, 15:38

is this the correct thing?
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Hexagon-Hd-M6-x-1 ... 1770wt_941

ive tried the local parts and tool shops... they dont have anything like it..

i3 · Post by i3 » 22 Apr 2010, 15:42

and is this the correct other part?
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/M6-X-M8-X-20-X-13 ... 1829wt_941

i3 · Post by i3 » 22 Apr 2010, 16:10

right,, i got the bleed nipple locally,,, but i cant find the reducer locally...

Post by **CitroJim** » 22 Apr 2010, 17:18

I3, I'm sorry, I should have said the reducer is a custom item I knocked up on the lathe. I'd be doubtful if such an item were available commercially to buy as they have no real purpose outside this and the job I originally devised them; that of retrieving otherwise scrap Pug 205 calipers with sheared bleed nipples.

A local engineer should be able to make you a reducer. It's a piece of brass with an M6 internal thread for the nipple, a small hole right through and an external M8 thread to screw into the rear of the sleve cylinder elbow. The length of M8 thread is critical at 6mm. Ther M6 thread needs to be at least 12mm long and a seat for the bottom of the bleed nipple needs to be cut at the base of the hole.

Hope that helps. Sorry for any confusion.

The reducer you found could be made to work but would need a small hole carefully drilled right through it and the M8 thread length reduced down to 6mm.

i3 · Post by i3 » 22 Apr 2010, 19:08

i dont know of any engineering shops round here that are able/willing to make this reducer for me... i dont suppose you could get one made for me and send it over to me? and ill paypal you the funds.... if thats not possible.. no worries...ill try getting that one off ebay and sorting that out....

Post by **CitroJim** » 22 Apr 2010, 19:14

I'll make one for you over the weekend i3, and also send you the modified elbow.

Won't be able to get it in the post 'till Monday afternoon though.

PM me your name and address...

Post by **CitroJim** » 23 Apr 2010, 21:30

I've made you a reducer i3 and when you PM me your address, I'll post it to you.

I made a very telling discovery this evening. I removed the slave cylinder from my project Activa to measure how deep the clutch fork is from the face of the slave cylinder boss. It's 2 inches.

Putting the slave cylinder back in I made a big, bad discovery and very nearly wrecked my own slave cylinder. Good job the Activa in question is a project

Basically, it's very easy to get the pushrod misaligned so that it ends up not sitting centrally in the cup on the end of the clutch arm when you replace the slave cylinder. It can easily fall off to one side and then, when you operate the clutch, the pushrod will simply travel further down the side of the arm by the cup and move out at an angle. This will push the front of the cylinder out and it ends up looking like this one of Dave's..

(Dave, I hope you don't mind me borrowing your picture?)

The clutch pedal will end up on the floor if this happens...

The front of mine had not pushed right out and I could pop it back in using a deep 24mm socket as a mandrel. It ended up at an angle.

The task of replacing the slave and getting the pushrod to sit centrally in the arm cup is a difficult job. The pushrod is held in a plastic tripod when new and this breaks on first application of the clutch. This tripod is essential to guide the pushrod to sit in the proper place in the middle of the cup. You can see the remains of it on a used slave cylinder.

I did manage to get mine popped back in and thankfully I still have a clutch although a bit of fluid did spill... It may still not be 100% good. It was a hell of a job and it was more by luck than judgment. Tomorrowe I'll see if there is a better, more reliable method.

It does seem though that even if the front of the salve cylinder does accidentally come out, the use of a 24mm socket as a mandrel does seem to more or less successfully push it back home.

That, I bet, is what happened originally to yours i3 and what initially caused all the grief. I would further wager that in all your subsequent attempts, you do not have the pushrod properly sitting in the cup but rather off to one side of it. Until you can guarantee the pushrod is sitting centrally in the cup, you'll never be able to bleed it.

I'm not sure if I posted this picture in this thread before but it shows the cup (green circle)

And this shows the cup in real life looking down the slave cylinder boss

Hope that helps i3...

We're nearly there!

i3 · Post by i3 » 23 Apr 2010, 22:07

this helps a load Jim! when i got hold of the replacement cylinder, it still had the plastic tripod in place,,, and thats when i managed to get a little bit of progress... since then,,nothing... i did think to myself the other day,,, that its as if the rod isnt actually touching that cup... because with the slave out,, i watched the rod moving in and out,,with the pedal being pushed down,,then pulled back up manually,,,, but once fitted in the housing,, i would expect it to do something at least,,but nothing... i will measure how deep in the fork is tomorrow hopefully.....
ill pm you over my address now... send it over whenever youre free... thanks