Finally got a 407 coupe, but....

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madmaxgav
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Re: Finally got a 407 coupe, but....

Post by madmaxgav »

Yey... get some things sorted... more things screw up.

So, it's been running like crap, hesitation and what to me sounded like diesel knock at about 2k rpm or when I give it a boot full. Managed to borrow a mates scanner this morning. Can anyone throw any light on these?

P0401 - Air Circuit. Quantity of air measured above the set point.
P0088 - Fuel Pressure regulator control. Rail pressure too high.
P1607 - Vehicle Speed limitation. Information Incoherent
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Re: Finally got a 407 coupe, but....

Post by EDC5 »

With regards to P0401, have you checked to see if the EGR has been blanked off? This fault indicates that the MAF is reading high.
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Re: Finally got a 407 coupe, but....

Post by madmaxgav »

I blanked the EGR off a couple of weeks ago thinking the EGR was knackered or clogged solid as the initial hesitation is horrendous when manoeuvring but blanking the EGR did make it very slightly better.... or at least I thought
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Re: Finally got a 407 coupe, but....

Post by EDC5 »

Ok, well then, that fault code (P0401) is to be expected as the ECU will see more air entering the MAF than it is expecting due to no intake air coming back from the exhaust. You can safely ignore it then.

Does the hesitation happen if you rev the engine in neutral or only under load?
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Re: Finally got a 407 coupe, but....

Post by GiveMeABreak »

If you've blanked it off the ECU will complain and eventually go into backup mode reducing engine power - best to get it cleaned or replaced and refitted (plus it will keep it legal).
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Re: Finally got a 407 coupe, but....

Post by madmaxgav »

Dammit, stop giving me good news lol.
Looks like the spanners are coming back out this weekend then. How much of a pain in the arse is the EGR to get off?

I obviously took a pic of the codes so I had a log of them, then cleared them to run the car for a day or 2 and see what comes back.
Here's the strange thing, the cars running a lot better. Still has a massive hesitation but nowhere near as bad as it was, and only happens when I try to pull away at a decent pace as opposed to normal. And that sound which to me seems like diesel knock, has almost gone??
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Re: Finally got a 407 coupe, but....

Post by EDC5 »

If it is still hesitating with the EGR blanked then the problem must lie elsewhere. From what I have gathered the P0401 isn't a hard error code on the older Euro 4 engines and doesn't cause a limp mode. It's just an observation. On newer Euro 5 cars, any degradation in the performance of emissions systems has to show an engine warning light.

As I say I've had that code on my car since I bought it and can only assume my EGR is clogged in some way. It's always been present but has never caused a warning light to come on.

If you have the time it might be worth taking the EGR valve off and cleaning it; it sounds from your symptoms that it is stuck open, flooding the inlet with exhaust gas.
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Re: Finally got a 407 coupe, but....

Post by madmaxgav »

That's why I blanked it off originally, felt very much like an EGR problem, had it on my 307 and all was well after blanking it off. Damn 407 doesn't matter if it's blanked or not.
So if that code relates to me blanking the EGR. Making me steer more in the direction of the other code for high fuel rail pressure. Any thoughts?
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Re: Finally got a 407 coupe, but....

Post by GiveMeABreak »

madmaxgav wrote: 02 Oct 2018, 16:00 Yey... get some things sorted... more things screw up.

So, it's been running like crap, hesitation and what to me sounded like diesel knock at about 2k rpm or when I give it a boot full. Managed to borrow a mates scanner this morning. Can anyone throw any light on these?

P0401 - Air Circuit. Quantity of air measured above the set point.
P0088 - Fuel Pressure regulator control. Rail pressure too high.
P1607 - Vehicle Speed limitation. Information Incoherent
Ok, so you have the Delphi Injection System in your 407. The fault codes are as follows - I would ignore the last one as that will be disconnected / disabled if there are any issues with the Injection Management System. P0401 is related to the EGR being blocked (number 1 on the suspect areas list) or in your case missing as you know, so getting that sorted would be a good start. Then your Mass Air Flow Meter - checking that is all cleaned (caution with the sensor wire - you need proper cleaner for that and don't touch it with anything that will damage it).

As you can see P0088 relates to too high a fuel pressure - but again could be symptomatic of the other components, so working through these should help.
Engine ECU DELPHI DCM3.4
Fault CodeP0401
After sales description of the fault codeAir system fault : Measured quantity of air higher than the setting
Description of the diagnosticsDiscrepancy for 10 seconds between the air flow setting and the measured air flow
Conditions of activation of the diagnosticsThe following conditions have to be met
Consult the associated contexts for the Pcode forwarding conditions
EGR valve regulation in operation
Conditions of disappearance of the faultVehicle driven for 5 minutes, remaining below an engine speed of 3000 rpm
Down-grade modes if fault presentDeactivation of diagnosis of coherence on the flowmeter
Switching on of the warning lamp and/or warning message-
Main customer complaints likelyNoise
Diesel fuel consumption a bit higher
Lack of power
Suspect areasElectric exhaust gas recycling valve
Air mixer
Air flow meter
Air leak after the compressor
Air flow sensor information incorrect
Vacuum problem
Variable geometry of the turbocharger jammed in the "maximum turbocharging" position
Turbocharging pressure sensor
Clogging of the exhaust gas recirculation circuit

Engine ECU DELPHI DCM3.4
Fault CodeP0088
After sales description of the fault codeHigh pressure fuel regulation : The measured rail pressure is too high in relation to the set point
Description of the diagnosticsThe ECU detects a difference of 180 bars to 250 bars for 3 to 6 seconds between the rail pressure set point and the measured rail pressure
Conditions of activation of the diagnosticsConsult the associated contexts for the Pcode forwarding conditions
Conditions of disappearance of the faultDriving for 5 minutes with several full load accelerations for 10 seconds
Down-grade modes if fault presentDeactivation of processing of the accelerometry
Deactivation of the accelerometry strategies
Deactivation of the detection of loop difference on the fuel flow rate regulator
Deactivation of the injector flow rate correction strategy
Switching on of the warning lamp and/or warning message-
Main customer complaints likelyJerking/stalling
Unwanted acceleration
Noise
Smoke from the exhaust
Lack of power
Starting problem
Suspect areasEngine ECU (Software not up to date
Poor fuel or polluted fuel (petrol, deposit, etc.)
Problem on the fuel low or high-speed circuit (hose, tank, diesel fuel filter, etc.)
Fuel injectors
Engine fuse box
Electrical harness
Connectors
High pressure fuel pump
Fuel high pressure sensor

Engine ECU DELPHI DCM3.4
Fault CodeP1607
After sales description of the fault codeVehicle speed limiter : Reference speed outside the tolerance
Description of the diagnosticsThe reference value is higher or lower than the ranges
The built-in systems interface sends incorrect information on the CAN
Conditions of activation of the diagnosticsConsult the associated contexts for the Pcode forwarding conditions
Conditions of disappearance of the faultIgnition on
Down-grade modes if fault present-
Switching on of the warning lamp and/or warning message-
Main customer complaints likelyCutting of the vehicle speed limiter
Suspect areasEngine ECU
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Re: Finally got a 407 coupe, but....

Post by madmaxgav »

Sorry it's been a while since I last posted. Between work and my house I've hardly had time to do anything.
Looked into things a bit more and replaced the mass air flow and intake pressure sensor.
That cured the first fault on the pics I'm posting, which hasn't come back although I have blanked the egr off.
There's a couple of other codes, I'm unsure on the passenger compartment one??
And then in the final pic, just when I thought all was fixed..... new one appears about turbo solenoid. Why is it I fix one thing and another appears ffs lol


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Last edited by GiveMeABreak on 22 Oct 2018, 16:25, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Finally got a 407 coupe, but....

Post by madmaxgav »

Quite happy our boss let us buy a scanner for our own cars, I'd be screwed in garage bills at this rate lol. That last fault about turbo pressure, I cleared it. If I drive "normally" it doesn't come back on. As soon as I put my foot down, not to give it a boot full, but enough to wake it up a little.. ping, it comes back on. Safe to say this car is officially doing my head in now, just want the thing right.
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Re: Finally got a 407 coupe, but....

Post by madmaxgav »

Now I'm officially annoyed :evil: :evil:
Thought everything was well and I'd finally got it behaving as it should. Yesterday noticed a very slight hesitation again on initial start up, but after pulling away from the house it wen't away. This morning, back to it's old self, hesitation is back. Damn thing nearly got itself written off doing it as I tried to nip out quickly on a roundabout near work. I give up, don't know what the hell to do now :shock:
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Re: Finally got a 407 coupe, but....

Post by GiveMeABreak »

Any fault codes remaining now Gav? Is it just P0238?

I think I already mentioned that blanking the EGR valve will result in a fault.
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Re: Finally got a 407 coupe, but....

Post by GiveMeABreak »

Ok, so P0238: Turbocharger pressure signal: Short circuit to positive

This means the Turbo air pressure is not plausible and that the voltage of the signal is higher than 4.8 V for 300 ms.
Back up / Downgrade Modes
Whilst this fault is showing, the engine ECU will:
  • Deactivate the speed limiter until the next time the ignition is switched on
  • Deactivate the cruise control until the next time the ignition is switched on
  • Will cut the EGR valve
  • Generic mode for reduced flow (so will cut power)
  • Deactivate the regulation of the turbocharging (Piloted turbocharging mode)
Symptoms:
  • Noise
  • Diesel fuel consumption a bit higher
  • Lack of power
Suspect Areas
  • Turbocharging pressure sensor
  • Turbocharger position copy sensor
  • Vacuum problem
  • Variable geometry of the turbocharger jammed in the "maximum turbocharging" position
  • Faulty turbocharger
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Re: Finally got a 407 coupe, but....

Post by madmaxgav »

Sorry for the late reply yet again. Just this min plugged it back in. 0 codes in engine management, not a single one. But hesitation is there massively, kangaroo'd so badly earlier that it almost got rear ended by a truck pulling away from lights. Really starting to get annoyed with it now
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