Iain's Barn Finds

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Iain's Barn Finds

Post by wurlycorner » 05 Feb 2018, 20:12

They're finds - in that although I parked them up there, it's been about 3-4 years since I last saw them... But I have found that they are still there!

Metallic blue S1 GTi T1 in front, ex Gerry Dennigan (if any members on here remember him and if I've spelt that correctly...) ABS and Air-Con, non-sunroof.
Metallic Grey S2 T1 GTi Turbo in rear, ex my dad. ABS no-air con or sunroof;
Image

Image
And hiding under there is a metallic green S1 GTi T1. Non-ABS, Non-Air-con but dreaded sunroof.

I had been planning to go over for some time, but not yet managed it. My hand is now being forced however, as I will be losing the space and need to get them moved. Alternative accommodation is one problem, getting them running so they can be moved is obviously another!
So after seven hours on Sunday, result is as follows;

Metallic Blue S1 GTi T1 = after purging lots of fuel I got it running (on two cylinders :roll: ) alternator completely seized (leaking thermostat housing onto an alternator that has run about 2 miles since I had it overhauled :evil: ) but suspension pumps up great, no leaks and tyres hold air. So that one can probably be moved ok but I really need to get it on 4 cylinders tbh. Alternator removed for repair.

Metallic Grey S2 GTi T1 = god knows what has happened to the starter motor. Absolutely nothing from it when jumped directly. No click, no current draw, nothing. So that's gonna have to come off. Couldn't face that horrendous job on the day so left it for next visit. One tyre refuses to hold air and the rad (that I had re-cored about 15 years ago) is leaking :roll: No further mice damage to the wiring than the last time I saw it had been ravaged, fortunately. Obviously no idea what will happen when suspension pumped up.

Metallic Green S2 GTi T1 = had it running, briefly. It will run while the cold start injector fires but dies when that times out. Pretty sure the fuel is stale and having tipped a gallon in still wasn't enough to mix it into usable state. Need to flush out all the old fuel and then refill with new and try again. Airs seem to hold air. Didn't have it running long enough to pump up the suspension so no idea on this one either. Hopefully ok because I replaced a lot of pipes before laying this one up, but.... 8-[
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Iain.

2x '85 CX GTi Turbo s1 (metallic blue and green)
2x '85 CX GTi Turbo s2 t1 (metallic silver and grey)
'88 CX GTi Turbo s2 T2 (metallic light blue)
CX DTR T2 Safari (silver)
2x '96 Xantia Activa (Black and Metallic Green)
'01 C5 2.0 HDi LX Estate (Blue)

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Re: Iain's Barn Finds

Post by wurlycorner » 05 Feb 2018, 20:17

So anyone out there got any ideas why the blue S1 is only running on 2 cylinders?

1 & 3 are running, 2 and 4 don't (although they did, initially).

Checked and ok;
- All 4 cylinders have spark
- Both +ve injector pins at the brown connector under the spare wheel (pins 2 and 3) have +12v when ignition on
- Wiring from brown connector to each injector bells out ok.

The only other common point I can find for a pair of injectors, is the ECU itself. And I don't believe that has suddenly failed.

So... Am I just unlucky and those two injectors have blocked????
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Iain.

2x '85 CX GTi Turbo s1 (metallic blue and green)
2x '85 CX GTi Turbo s2 t1 (metallic silver and grey)
'88 CX GTi Turbo s2 T2 (metallic light blue)
CX DTR T2 Safari (silver)
2x '96 Xantia Activa (Black and Metallic Green)
'01 C5 2.0 HDi LX Estate (Blue)

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Re: Iain's Barn Finds

Post by ekjdm14 » 05 Feb 2018, 22:31

All 4 have spark when checked, but is the spark strong enough to fire the plugs when under compression, or has a plug failed internally in such a way to drag down the other side of the coil? (possible bit of debris loosened on start up has bent an electrode into a dead short?)

Or perhaps as you say you're unlucky with the 2 injectors, sounds unlikely though, I guess you could maybe eliminate/prove it out by spraying a little petrol down it's throat and see if the dead pots kick in momentarily.

Sorry to hear you're losing storage & best of luck finding suitable accommodation quickly.
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'95 Xantia LX 1.9D(n/a) auto, Black, 100k miles ("new" engine on 150+k)
'97 Xantia Desire 1.9TD manual, White, 137k (bent rod replaced, turbo now suffering)
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Re: Iain's Barn Finds

Post by wurlycorner » 05 Feb 2018, 23:02

Yeah I was initially sure it must be ignition related, since the plugs are paired 1+3 & 2+4, however visually (tested outside) the spark is same strength in each pair.
Friend who was with me suggested might not be strong enough when under compression. He has a colourtune which we'll try next time we're over.
1
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Iain.

2x '85 CX GTi Turbo s1 (metallic blue and green)
2x '85 CX GTi Turbo s2 t1 (metallic silver and grey)
'88 CX GTi Turbo s2 T2 (metallic light blue)
CX DTR T2 Safari (silver)
2x '96 Xantia Activa (Black and Metallic Green)
'01 C5 2.0 HDi LX Estate (Blue)

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'02 206 Style 1.4HDi - 103k prior to glow plug debacle and head rebuild, 2mi since
'91 Ford Escort 1.6i Cabriolet - 106k
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Re: Iain's Barn Finds

Post by ekjdm14 » 05 Feb 2018, 23:09

I've always wanted to try out a colourtune, never really had cause to buy one though & my curiosity to view actual internal combustion has been satisfied now by youtube and countless plexiglass-headed Briggs & Stratton lumps... Could prove very useful though in this case, fingers crossed.
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'95 Xantia LX 1.9D(n/a) auto, Black, 100k miles ("new" engine on 150+k)
'97 Xantia Desire 1.9TD manual, White, 137k (bent rod replaced, turbo now suffering)
'02 206 Style 1.4HDi, Mercury Grey, 103k miles (head rebuild completed 15/6/18)

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Re: Iain's Barn Finds

Post by jonwend » 07 Feb 2018, 22:44

It does sound like a failed or failing coil. I have had this happen on a couple of cars but can't remember if the plugs were still sparking or not. I remember years ago my friend increasing the boost on a rover turbo (I think) to the point where the car wouldn't run under boost and it felt like the coils were packing up. The thought back then was that the spark plugs couldn't cope with the increased boost (they were standard) so I suppose it is possible that your plugs will spark but not enough to work under compression. Can you swap the coils around and see if the fault shifts to the other cylinders? That is quite a collection you have there :-)
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Re: Iain's Barn Finds

Post by CitroJim » 09 Feb 2018, 08:04

ekjdm14 wrote:
05 Feb 2018, 23:09
I've always wanted to try out a colourtune


They do work... And used to be really valuable back in the old days of carbs...

No so much use nowadays on injection systems...
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Re: Iain's Barn Finds

Post by demag » 09 Feb 2018, 13:15

I used to have a Colourtune, good bit of kit.
Did you say you'd tried different plugs?
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Re: Iain's Barn Finds

Post by wurlycorner » 09 Feb 2018, 17:39

I've had them out and inspected and cleaned them. Can't see any problems with them, but haven't tried swapping and it could be they're not in good nick internally, so could do...
Thanks for the suggestion.
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Iain.

2x '85 CX GTi Turbo s1 (metallic blue and green)
2x '85 CX GTi Turbo s2 t1 (metallic silver and grey)
'88 CX GTi Turbo s2 T2 (metallic light blue)
CX DTR T2 Safari (silver)
2x '96 Xantia Activa (Black and Metallic Green)
'01 C5 2.0 HDi LX Estate (Blue)

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Re: Iain's Barn Finds

Post by Zelandeth » 11 Feb 2018, 17:58

CitroJim wrote:
09 Feb 2018, 08:04
ekjdm14 wrote:
05 Feb 2018, 23:09
I've always wanted to try out a colourtune


They do work... And used to be really valuable back in the old days of carbs...

No so much use nowadays on injection systems...


If you want to borrow one for the Skoda Jim just let me know. I've got one in the garage that I've actually seen recently, so should be able to track it down without *too* much trouble!
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Re: Iain's Barn Finds

Post by CitroJim » 11 Feb 2018, 18:53

Thanks Zel :)
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Re: Iain's Barn Finds

Post by wurlycorner » 11 Feb 2018, 20:27

Not been back to the cars this weekend, spent the last couple of days sussing out easiest way to connect to the fuel rail HP banjo unit (it's an M10x1 bolt, btw). Think I have a solution sussed now...
Also then worked on the seized alternator.
Spent about 4 hours on the damn thing and failed to remove either the front or rear casting, despite use of a wacking great gear puller and/or actually wacking it with a 3LB club hammer... :roll: However, I was successful in freeing it off so it spins again and the bearings feel fine, so re-assembled and will try it out.

Also looks like I have found a suitable replacement storage place, which will provide much better conditions (it's an insulated small barn, previously used for mushroom growing!). Unfortunately more expensive though :(

With all that sorted, I will head back over to my lost friends, next weekend...
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Iain.

2x '85 CX GTi Turbo s1 (metallic blue and green)
2x '85 CX GTi Turbo s2 t1 (metallic silver and grey)
'88 CX GTi Turbo s2 T2 (metallic light blue)
CX DTR T2 Safari (silver)
2x '96 Xantia Activa (Black and Metallic Green)
'01 C5 2.0 HDi LX Estate (Blue)

wurlycorner
Posts: 1409
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Location: Chelmsford, Essex
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A couple of Xantia...
Lots of Prelude's...
And a Sunny.
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Re: Iain's Barn Finds

Post by wurlycorner » 18 Feb 2018, 23:41

Back to them today. First up was flushing the old fuel from one;
Image
I sussed out that LPG hose was significantly cheaper than car fuel hose, but rated for the same kind of fuel and pressure. 9mm ID was perfect for screwing the M10x1 banjo bolt into and hey presto :)
Watching the fuel pump out pointed to the flow not being consistent - it sorted of 'pumped' rather than continuously flowed. I went to the back of the car to check whether the pump was running smoothly and while I was there, heard the unmistakable sound of a metal tank collapsing in on itself, under vacuum.
Opening the fill cap caused a long intake of air and the tank popped open again. Hmm... Seems the tank vent system is blocked... Bingo! (we thought...) Topped it up with fresh fuel and we tried running it with the filler cap off and... Same
:-x
Ran while the cold start injector sprayed and then cut out, but... This time it smelt like it was running very rich.
Stripped down the intake system, in case there was something blocking that and found that the filter was completely rotten and the bottom of the filter housing was completely rotten out;
Image
Image

Haha! More possible causes..?
Nope, same.
So time to start messing around with injectors.
Unplugged the cold start injector and it wouldn't start at all.
Tried unplugging the injector plugs with the intention of seeing whether they were doing anything (or it was literally running just on the cold start injector) and could only unplug two of them.
Turned it over and... It sat there idling happily in two...
:dunno:
Plugged them back in, no difference. Still happily running on two.
WTF?!
Took the plugs out, found it is running on the wrong ones (it's using long nose GTi plugs rather than short nose GTi Turbo plugs) and the gaps were atrocious - something like 0.4 when they're meant to be 0.8, so sorted that out, but... No difference!
Got frustrated and started fiddling with the injectors while running and suddenly it started running on three.
Out came the screwdriver, whacked the fourth one and... Bingo!
:eek1:
Nothing more than two stuck injectors!
Tightened up the pressure regulator bleed screw, suspension pumped up, drove it out into the sunlight for the first time in years
:cd:
Image
Last edited by wurlycorner on 27 Feb 2018, 20:13, edited 1 time in total.
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--
Iain.

2x '85 CX GTi Turbo s1 (metallic blue and green)
2x '85 CX GTi Turbo s2 t1 (metallic silver and grey)
'88 CX GTi Turbo s2 T2 (metallic light blue)
CX DTR T2 Safari (silver)
2x '96 Xantia Activa (Black and Metallic Green)
'01 C5 2.0 HDi LX Estate (Blue)

wurlycorner
Posts: 1409
Joined: 30 Oct 2012, 23:37
Location: Chelmsford, Essex
My Cars: Lots of CXs...
A couple of Xantia...
Lots of Prelude's...
And a Sunny.
x 45

Re: Iain's Barn Finds

Post by wurlycorner » 19 Feb 2018, 00:02

Flushed with success, was pretty confident that the cause of the blue one running on two cylinders was also likely to be stuck injectors.
Fired it up (still on two) two sharp taps from a screwdriver later and... Sure enough! Running on all four 8-)
Tightened up the pressure regulator bleed screw again so we could move it and get better access to the starter on the grey one parked behind... Boosh! Cloud of lhm
:roll:
Pipe burst. Fortunately the easiest one to replace (from the regulator to the main accumulator) so have whiped that off and brought it home to make up a copy ahead of next weekend

Got it moved slightly anyway and then set about removing the starter on the last (third) cx.

Right pita, crap access, seized bolts and only just enough room to scrape it out under the car with it sat on the deck, but got there in the end.
Fault turned out to be nothing more than a dirty terminal on the solenoid! Ran out of time to refit it, but at least I know that bit is sorted (rest of that car remains an unknown at the moment, until it's refitted).

Sorry no pics of this bit.
Last edited by wurlycorner on 19 Feb 2018, 10:18, edited 1 time in total.
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Iain.

2x '85 CX GTi Turbo s1 (metallic blue and green)
2x '85 CX GTi Turbo s2 t1 (metallic silver and grey)
'88 CX GTi Turbo s2 T2 (metallic light blue)
CX DTR T2 Safari (silver)
2x '96 Xantia Activa (Black and Metallic Green)
'01 C5 2.0 HDi LX Estate (Blue)

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CitroJim
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Posts: 41565
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Re: Iain's Barn Finds

Post by CitroJim » 19 Feb 2018, 09:00

Iain, really enjoying these latest updates :D Keep 'em coming ;)
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