C5 Clutch over reving when pulling away.

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galonki
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C5 Clutch over reving when pulling away.

Post by galonki »

Hi guys,

As stated in the title my C5 clutch is about to go because the car has started to over rev when pulling away and changing gears.

It needs doing and before i go to a garage i would like to get an unbiased view of how much i can expect this to set me back to put right.

Mr Clutch gave me an online quote of £315 - parts, labour, vat, 2 year 20,000 warranty.

So i know every other place much be cheaper because i guess they are like autoglasssss.

In addition, do you reckon i should change the flywheel aswell? If so how much roughly in addition do you think it will cost?

Thanks.

P.S. - Can anyone recommend any mechanics for this job in the east london area.

just remembered one more thing, took a look on eurocarparts for the clutch kit and was given 3 choices:
1 valeo kit £205.20
1 unbranded kit £117.60
1 Transmech kit £83.99

is it worth it to buy the valeo kit at more than double the cost of transmech?
2008 PEUGEOT 308 1.6 HDI 90 BHP.
2003 CITROEN C5 2.0 HDI 110 BHP. (Sold)
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timborob
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Re: C5 Clutch over reving when pulling away.

Post by timborob »

galonki wrote:Hi guys,

As stated in the title my C5 clutch is about to go because the car has started to over rev when pulling away and changing gears.

It needs doing and before i go to a garage i would like to get an unbiased view of how much i can expect this to set me back to put right.

Mr Clutch gave me an online quote of £315 - parts, labour, vat, 2 year 20,000 warranty.

So i know every other place much be cheaper because i guess they are like autoglasssss.

In addition, do you reckon i should change the flywheel aswell? If so how much roughly in addition do you think it will cost?

Thanks.

P.S. - Can anyone recommend any mechanics for this job in the east london area.

just remembered one more thing, took a look on eurocarparts for the clutch kit and was given 3 choices:
1 valeo kit £205.20
1 unbranded kit £117.60
1 Transmech kit £83.99

is it worth it to buy the valeo kit at more than double the cost of transmech?
Hi galonki

Sorry to hear you have a slipping clutch.
I have the same model car as you and can tell you by what I have read that the DMF most likely is in need of replacement.

Good News is you can get a Solid Flywheel kit which will bring the costs down. Fellow FCF member Citroenmad has had fitted to his original
C5 and as far as I read is going strong and may comment later on
and give you more detail and what's the better Clutch kit to fit.

I would look for help to get it fitted from a member on here if possible ?
or take it to a recommended Independent garage.

I Live in South London and if my clutch were slipping and I could not get help here on the forum I would try Vantage Citroen based in Wimbledon.
The guy I spoke to on the phone in the past certainly was knowledgeable on the Handbrake setup on our car

Best of Luck with getting it fixed and a good value cost.
Regards
Tim

03 Citroen C5 2.0 110 HDI VTR Mauritius Blue 109K
411514
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Post by 411514 »

The general consensus seems to be that when splitting the box from the block to do the clutch it is wise to do the flywheel also to save labour at a later date.
However im not sure that this is always necessary, if the car has been driven easily in the past then there really should be no need to do the fly as this will bump up the cost significantly.
To be honest that price from mr clutch sounds reasonable, il be surprised if youl find it a lot cheapr as it is a fair amount of work to change the clutch.
However if you are handy with the spanners and have a bit of spare time theres really no reason why you couldnt do it yourself, im far from a mechanic and i did it in less than 1 day with pretty basic tools, im not sure without checking but i believe that those price quoted on eurocarparts differ so much as the valeo includes the solid flywheel too. Hope you sort it, sam
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Post by Citroenmad »

We bought a 53reg C5 2.0 110 HDi estate a few years back. It had done 105,000 miles and the clutch was very weak. The clutch was replaced and it drive fine, no signs of the DMF having been worn.

So its very possible to have a worn out friction plate without the DMF being worn out too. However since the clutch is being done it is very beneficial to get the DMF changed (possibly for a solid one) to save costs in the long term.

We have a 52 reg 2.0HDi 110 with a solid flywheel, its DMF failed at 60K miles. Its now done 130K miles and its perfect, 70K miles on the solid flywheel. Im pretty glad it has a solid flywheel, as without it the 2.0HDi 110 C5 is a very well sorted car, which is why we keep a hold of this one.

However, if replacing the DMF (which I would recommend with the friction plate being worn out) then costs will increase. Though I believe the solid flywheel is a cheaper option to the DMF and it will last longer too.
Chris
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galonki
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Post by galonki »

Citroenmad wrote:We bought a 53reg C5 2.0 110 HDi estate a few years back. It had done 105,000 miles and the clutch was very weak. The clutch was replaced and it drive fine, no signs of the DMF having been worn.

So its very possible to have a worn out friction plate without the DMF being worn out too. However since the clutch is being done it is very beneficial to get the DMF changed (possibly for a solid one) to save costs in the long term.

We have a 52 reg 2.0HDi 110 with a solid flywheel, its DMF failed at 60K miles. Its now done 130K miles and its perfect, 70K miles on the solid flywheel. Im pretty glad it has a solid flywheel, as without it the 2.0HDi 110 C5 is a very well sorted car, which is why we keep a hold of this one.

However, if replacing the DMF (which I would recommend with the friction plate being worn out) then costs will increase. Though I believe the solid flywheel is a cheaper option to the DMF and it will last longer too.
hi, thanks for all of your responses; DMF has come up in more than 1 post and i would like to know if there is anyway of telling if my DMF has failed.

Citroenmad, you said your DMF failed at 60k miles, how do i know if it is my clutch that has failed or my DMF?

Is it possible that the DMF can fail but the clutch is fine?

Sorry if i seem noobish but i am learning.

By the way to help, my car now has 140k miles on the clock, and i bought it second hand but i do not believe the clutch has been touched before, but theres no true way of telling.
2008 PEUGEOT 308 1.6 HDI 90 BHP.
2003 CITROEN C5 2.0 HDI 110 BHP. (Sold)
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Post by Citroenmad »

I bought that C5 at 100K miles so I wasnt the owner when the DMF failed. Though its owner told me the clutch started to slip, on renewal the DMF was found to be at fault, despite the friction lining being good.

I really fail to see how some DMFs seemingly fail at as low as 40K miles and others go on for 100-150K miles+. It must be linked to useage, it does seem logical that when riding the clutch heat is built up, this along with the extra stress put on it will wear it quicker.

If you think your clutch is original, at 140K id get the DMF replaced, replaced with a solid one too. Get the mechanic to throughly inspect the DMF and assess its condition. If the friction plate is worn it will be evident, if the DMF has failed that will be too. Inspection is needed to find the cause.

Apparently the first signs of DMF failures is squeaking when turning the engine on and off.
Chris
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wright
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Post by wright »

a bad dmf will rattle and the car will be a bit jumpy reversing, my clutch was done recently at 160k and the dmf was fine and still on the car,
02 C5 2.0 hdi 110
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Post by cachaciero »

Citroenmad wrote: I really fail to see how some DMFs seemingly fail at as low as 40K miles and others go on for 100-150K miles+. It must be linked to useage, it does seem logical that when riding the clutch heat is built up, this along with the extra stress put on it will wear it quicker.
That's probably a large part of it though there can be no doubt that a DMF is a considerably more fragile item than a solid flywheel and it does not sink heat anywhere near as well as a standard flywheel, so it may be that even "normal" levels of slipping the clutch will heat the friction components far more than would be the case with a solid flywheel, goes without saying that the clutch half of the DMF will also get very hot.
I am sure that part of it is also the fact that this will be built down to a price which will almost certainly equates to a variation in quality one item / batch to another.

achaciero
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Post by flying clutchman »

On any car fitted with a DMF I always recommend changing it (solid conversion is fine) as it is impossible to really tell the condition of the DMF visually. (unless it's actually falling apart!) I've known DMFs to fail at 30k miles (ford fusion) and 50-60k is quite common. DMFs are only made by a couple of companies (LUK & VALEO) so all makes of car are affected. A Valeo solid conversion kit will include flywheel, clutch kit and new bolts so usually works out cheaper than a new DMF + kit.
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Post by citroenxm »

Are the DMF Flywheels the same as the Xantia HDi soild flywheels??

Paul
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Post by flying clutchman »

The valeo conversion kit is a matched set specifically designed to replace the DMF and asociated clutch, not just a solid flywheel with a clutch kit.
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Post by 411514 »

Surely there is some benefit to having the correct dmf rather than a standard solid flywheel
otherwise citroen wouldnt have bothered with the additional expense when manufacturing it.
I know the dmf is designed mainly as a comfort aid i.e ironing out torque spikes when releasing the clutch and to avoid stalling so surely there must be a significant disadvantage to removing it for a solid fly.
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Post by Citroenmad »

411514 wrote:So surely there must be a significant disadvantage to removing it for a solid fly.
No! :lol:

70K on a solid flywheel conversion on our 52 C5 2.0HDi 110 and its perfect, no harshness, just feels like a normal clutch.

DMFs are poorly designed things which you can really do without. On a 110 id not consider replacing the DMF, just get rid of it.

The dual mass flywheel on the above C5 lasted 60K miles. Its solid flywheel clutch has done 70K miles and its still perfect ... that says it all.

Its the only real thing which lets down the 2.0HDi 110 C5s, the DMF, everything else is very well sorted on those.
Chris
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Post by flying clutchman »

411514 wrote:Surely there is some benefit to having the correct dmf rather than a standard solid flywheel
otherwise Citroën wouldnt have bothered with the additional expense when manufacturing it.
I know the dmf is designed mainly as a comfort aid i.e ironing out torque spikes when releasing the clutch and to avoid stalling so surely there must be a significant disadvantage to removing it for a solid fly.
Nearly all transit owners change to solid when the clutch is changed. No difference in drive at all. Look how much a DMF costs, it's a nice earner for the clutch manufacterers.
galonki
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Post by galonki »

hi guys, all of your responses have been really helpful and are appreciated; i think in the end i am going to go for the valeo solid flywheel conversion kit as some have suggested that there is no way of telling if the flywheel is almost finished.

but now having searched so much on the net, i have found some other people from search engine results saying that only the 1.6 hdi 110bhp has the DMF and that the 2.0 HDi 110bhp or 90bhp does not.

Can anyone confirm whether the 2003 Citroen C5 2.0 HDi 110bhp definately has a DMF?

Thanks in advance.

P.S. - Will the valeo conversion kit from eurocarparts fit just based on my reg number which i entered into the website or is there something else i need to check to ensure the part is the correct one for my car?
2008 PEUGEOT 308 1.6 HDI 90 BHP.
2003 CITROEN C5 2.0 HDI 110 BHP. (Sold)
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